Author Topic: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?  (Read 1968 times)

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Offline MerchantDeryni

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How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« on: October 24, 2018, 02:18:04 pm »
So my Pepper and Lace story centers around transfer portals as a means of moving cargo.
My baseline assumption is that a person can carry a backpack with 100-125 pounds on it through  a portal transfer. I picked 100-125 pounds because it is a 'quintal'of weight to use an old term. the difference i weight is which book you believe. :)

Then I started thinking about passengers. Portal use generally is three people per trip. That is all that can fit on the portal area. In the Deryni adventure game they also have a 3 person max.

Paying the price for the shift in location is done by the operator of the portal. That price can be paid by the operator, or the operator can siphon off the energy from another person to balance the energies.

If the passengers are also carrying a quintal of goods then each passenger represents about 250 to 300 pounds per person. A knight in armour would be around 200 pounds. If they had supplies on them they could be 300 pounds.
Two passengers represents an extra 600 pounds going through the portal, for about 900 pounds total moved per trip.

So here are the questions:
Would it be reasonable to stack 700 pounds of goods on the portal and have a 200 pound operator shift the 900 pounds to the next portal?
Or do the goods have to be carried by a person?
In the Camber books the Michaeline compounds were supplied through a siege by portals. This would have needed a lot of food brought through a portal to supply the men each day. Would it all have to have been carried on a person?

Does it cost more in energy and fatigue to move 1 person or 3 people through a portal?
In the other thread I started I quoted from the books that a person makes 2 or 3 jumps per day, normally. If they take 2 passengers does that qualify as 3 trips of energy all in one shot? Or can all 3 people make 3 trips?

Siphoning off the energy from the other 2 passengers could result in 1 person each donating 3 trips of energy per day, so the 3 jumps could still be done, or am I reaching on this one?

Offline whitelaughter

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Re: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2018, 11:27:04 pm »
In a crisis, one human can shift two others, so I've always assumed that a safe rule of thumb is 'a Deryni can shift whatever they could personally carry'.

A counter-question - is there a case of a Deryni moving two other people when it isn't a crisis? Because that would let us know whether this is the top end limit, or merely the limits of the size of the Portal: if they only move one person at a time when there is no time pressure, then two must be a major effort.

While taking energy from the passenger makes sense, I'm curious as to why units during the Festillic era weren't trained specifically for this: it specifically says in St Camber that portals can't shift enough troops to make a difference, but I would have thought that elite military units, who as part of their training practiced Portal jumping, would have been invaluable for the Deryni lords.

Offline Laurna

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Re: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2018, 01:54:26 pm »
I had an odd thought. If portals are charged by the people who use them, than can a portal be overcharged to the point that it must have time off before being used again? Portals grow cold with disuse, can the "Overheat" with too much use. Too munch energy in the stone and you have to wait for the surrounding earth to dissipate that energy.  Remember this is all about Balance.

I am thinking the goods have to be carried, it is living cells that are being shifted from one place to another not the floor or carpet lying over the portal stone. The non-living material has to be held or surround that the living material and thusly pulled with the people. The carpet stays put, but your shoes go because they surround your feet. A create of goods resting on the portal stone would stay put, just as the carpet does.

Offline MerchantDeryni

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Re: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2018, 03:03:10 pm »
Three people can use a portal under normal conditions, no emergency needed.
Kelson, Morgan and Duncan use a portal to show Kelson how they are used in Deryni Rising.

"Duncan stepped back into the transfer cubicle, then motioned Morgan and Kelson to join him. The
compartment was small, but they managed to squeeze into the space provided. Morgan and Duncan both
put their hands on Kelson's shoulders.
"Ready?" Duncan asked.
Morgan nodded. "Kelson, I want you to just relax and let your mind go blank. You aren't able to operate
one of these portals on your own, yet, so we're just going to carry you through between us like so many
potatoes in a sack."
"Very well," Kelson replied.
The priest glanced at the boy sharply, made suddenly aware that, all unconsciously, the youth had spoken
as a king giving'consent—where no consent had even been asked. He wondered if Alaric had noticed.
Kelson closed his eyes, trying to think of nothing at all. He tried visualizing total blackness, letting his mind
detach itself from its awareness. He was dimly aware of Morgan's hand tightening on his shoulder. Then
there was a sickening wrench in the pit of his stomach, a fleeting impression of falling, a slight dizzy
He opened his eyes to darkness. They were no longer in the study."

So 3 people can use a portal with no issues, even when, as it is explained to Kelson that portals are an almost lost art. I would argue, from the point of view of my fanfic at least, that they area  lost art within Gwynedd, but may not be a lost art anywhere else. :)

As for overcharging it seems that portals get more stable and easier to use if they are used regularly. Page 93 of Deryni Magic says that portals used regularly are easier to operate as the excess of energy tends to reinforce the portal matrix.

I'm actually using that idea in my Pepper and Lace stories. Victoria, the portal adept 'tunes' portals across the network to make them easier to use. She basically charges them with energy and makes them stronger. this smooths out the ride for the other users, and their frequent use strengthens the portals further. At least that is how I am doing it in my universe. :)

Offline whitelaughter

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Re: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2018, 09:17:18 pm »
 yes, but that example of 3 people is 2 Deryni carrying one passenger; and specifying 'we' carrying Kelson through. Efficient, and the logical thing to do - but doesn't let us know how hard it is to move other people.

Offline Bynw

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Re: How much weight/cargo can a person move through a Portal?
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2018, 09:26:24 pm »
I've always went with the limit of 3 persons and what they can carry. But of course even if all 3 are Deryni, they are in rapport and one of them is doing the actual transfer. So I think that would mean that 1 Deryni could carry more items by weight but he would still have to be in physical contact with everything since he can't be in rapport with it.


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