Deryni FAQ
1. In what order should the Deryni books be read?
We have listed the books in chronological order. Katherine recommends reading them in the order published. (That means starting with the Chronicles of the Deryni and then reading the Camber series.) Members of alt.books.deryni newsgroup have debated this at length without reaching a consensus. Most recommend starting with either Deryni Rising or Camber of Culdi, although a reasonable argument can be made for starting with The Bishop's Heir. The Heirs of Saint Camber is a particularly dark trilogy so it's not a recommended starting point except for readers with a taste for the darker books. Deryni Archives, Deryni Magic, and Codex Derynianus should be read after the other books to be fully understood.
2. Are there two Deryni Archives? What's the difference?
The Deryni Archives book contains short stories written by Katherine Kurtz.
Deryni Archives: The Magazine contains fan fiction which is edited by Julianne Toomey-Kautz and Laura Jefferson, as well as Katherine herself.
3. What are the Eleven Kingdoms?
The Lay of the Lord Llewellyn appears at the front of Camber of Culdi.
Now, these are the Names of the Eleven Kingdoms, sung rightly well of old:
Howicce, and Llannedd, and fierce Connait; mountainous Meara, the Land Beyond the River; and Kheldour, the windswept; and pastoral Eastmarch; Tolan, and Torenth, and myth-ridden Mooryn; and lost Caeriesse, which sank beneath the sea; and far-reaching Gwynedd, seat of the Haldane Kings.
--Lay of the Lord Llewellyn
Troubadour to the High
King of Mooryn
Tolan, Torenth, Caeriesse, Gwynedd, Howicce, Llanedd, Connait, are all pretty straightforward. (It should be noted that the Duchy of Haldane is a part of the Kingdom of Gwynedd. However, a cursory summary of the history of Gwynedd's founding would seem to indicate that the Haldane duchy was, among several other pieces of land, a precursor to Gwynedd rather than absorbed by it.)
Mooryn is the original land now comprised of Corwyn and Carthmoor. Meara became Cassan, Kierney, and what's now called Meara. Kheldour became the Duchy of Claibourne and the Earldom of Rhendall. The Earldom of Rhendall, like the Earldom of Kierney's relationship with Cassan, is held by the heir of the Duke of Claibourne. Also a product of this splitting was the Kheldish Riding, held directly as a Crown territory (I believe) And Eastmarch split into Eastmarch and Marley.
--Felan
4. How do I pronounce all these names?
Please see the Pronunciation Guides below for pronunciation help with Katherine's exotic names--personal, place, and miscellaneous.
For more information, please follow this link to the FAQ online that Rebecca Davis has created at http://www.mindspring.com/~rebldavis/faq.html (http://www.mindspring.com/~rebldavis/faq.html). The Rebecca Davis FAQ needs to be updated as it does not cover material from Childe Morgan forward.
A
Ailin – EYE-lin
Ainslie – AIN-slee
Airsid – AIR-sid
Alpheios – Al-FAY-ose
Ansel – AN'-sell
Arilan – AIR-i-lan
Arkady – Ar-CADE-y
Azim – Ah-ZEEM
B
Bened – BEN-ed
Berrhones – Behr-HONE-ess
Bradene – Bray-DENE
C
Cardiel – Car-dee-EL
Cashel- CASH-ell
Cathan – CATH (as in Catherine)-an
Caulay – CAW-lee
Charissa – Kar-ISS-a
Ciard O'Ruane – Shard O'Ru-AIN
Cinhil—KIN-hil, with the h almost swallowed.
Cloyce –Kloyce
Cluim – Kloom or KLOO-im
Columcille – KOL-um-kill
Cosim – KOSS-im
Creoda—Cree-O-da
Crinan – KRIN-nan
Czalsky – ZAL-sky
D
Dafydd—Dah-VEETH
Daithi –DY-hee
Declan – DECK-lan
Deiniol – DY-nyoll
Dervel – DER-vill
Donatus – Don-A-tis
Dothan—DAW-thun
E
Eirian – EER-ee-an
Eithne—ETH-nee
Etienne – Ay-tee-ENN
Eugen – OY-gin (g as in go)
Evaine – Ee-VAIN
Ewan – EW-an
F
Faelan—FAY-lin
G
Giles—Jiles
Gorony – GOR-ony
Guaire – Gwaire
Guiscard—Gees-CARD
H
Haldane – HAL-dane
Halex – HAL-ex
Hombard – HOM-burd
Hrorik – Rorik – the H is silent
Husniyya – Huss-NEE-uh
I
Imre—IM-ray
Iosef – YO-seff
Irenaeus – Ihr-in-AY-us
Istelyn – EE-styll-in
Ithel – ITH-il
J
Jatham – JA (a as in accent)-thum
Jenas—JEN-us
Jervis – JER-viss
Jilyan – JIL-yan
Jodoc – JOD (o as in obvious)-oc
Jolyon – JOL-yan
Judhael – Judd-HALE
K
Kai—KY
Karis—KARE-is
Kilian – KILL-yan
Kinevan – Kin-EH-ven
Kyriell – KEER-ee-el
L
Lajos—LAY-jose (long O)
Lior—LEE-or.
Llarik—hLAR-ick
Llewell – HLEW-ill (the H should be breathed rather than said so that it's soft)
M
Maccul – Ma-KOOL
Magan – MAG-in
Mahael – Ma-HAIL
Matyas – MATT-yash
Meraude – Merr-AUDE
Michaela—Mich (soft ch, as in le chaim)-AE-la
Michon – Mee-SHOHN
Miklos – MIK-losh
Mir – Like the space station
N
Niall, Niallan – NY-all or NY-a-lan
Nieve –Neeve (Nieve is the phonetic spelling of the Irish Niamh)
Nimur—NEE-mur
Nivard—Nih-VARD
O
Oriel – As in the window, OR-ee-el
P
Piran—PEER-an
R
Remie—RAY-mee
Revan—REV-an
Rhetice—Rhe-TEES
Rhodri—ROAD-ri
Rhys –Rees
Rhysel – REE-s'l
Richeldis—Ri-CHEL-dis
Richenda—Rish-EN-da
Rogier—Ro-gi-EHR
S
Secorim—Sih-COR-um
Sicard—Si-CARD
Sighere—SIG-er-uh
Sinead—Shin-AID
Siward – SEE-ward
Sulien – SOO-lee-en
T
Tagas—TAG-as (Tag is pronounced as in the German Tag for day)
Tavis—TA-vis (a-as in average)
Tieg – Teeg
Tiercel – TIER-s'l
Tomais—To-MAIS
Torcuill—TOR-quill
Trahern – Trah-HAIRN
U
Udaut – U-DAWT
Urien—YOUR-ee-en
W
Wencit—WEN-sit
X
Ximena – She-MAIN-uh
A
Argoed—AR-go-ed
B
Beldour – BEL-dour (the 'our' is pronounced as in "hour" Same rule applies to Kheldour and Lendour.
Bremagne—Breh-MAAN-nyeh. (The nyeh syllable is just barely an afterthought at the end.)
C
Caerrorie – Caer-ROR-ee
Candor Rhea – Can-dor RAY
Cuilteine—Kull-TEEN
D
Djellarda—Jell-ARE-da
E
Ebor—EE-bor
F
Forcinn – FOR-sin
G
Gwernach—GWAIR-nach – the ch is pronounced rather like a cat hiss.
Gwynedd – GWYN-neth
H
Haut Eirial – Hout EAR-ee-il
I
Iomaire – EYE-o-mare
Iveagh – Ivy
J
Jandrich – YON-drich, according to Rob Reginald
Joux– Joo
K
Komnene – Comb-NENN
L
Llannedd—hLLAN-neth
Llegoddin—hLe-GOTH-in
Llentieth—hLen-TEETH
Logreine—Low-GRAIN
N
Neot – NEE-ot
R
Ramos—RAY-mos
Rhemuth – Ray-mith
U
Uiskin—WIS-kin
V
Valoret—VAL-or-ett
Miscellaneous terms
Deryni—Dare-IN-ee
Shiral—SHEER-al
Sidhe – Shee
Skean-Dubh – Skee-an-DOO
According to Katherine, the following personal and place names are properly pronounced as they are spelled.
Belden
Bran
Brion
Briony
Caitrin
Camber
Camlin
Cullen
Denis
Embert
Gallard
Joram
Jorian
Kennet
Kyla
Kylan
Lael
Lambert
MacRorie
Marek
Marluk
Quiric
Rasoul
Rathold
Raymer
Rhydon
Rhysem
Rickart
Ronal
Rothana
Tambert
Vanissa
Place Names
Carcashale
Cassan
Corwyn
Culliecairn
Danoc
Jenas
Laas
Lochalyn
Mooryn
Nyford
Ratharkin
Sheele
St. Foillan's
Transha
I have found two different sites that pronounce Alaric differently. Either seems to be considered acceptable.
A LAR ic 3 syllables with emphasis on second syllable
AL aric 2 syllables with emphasis on first syllable.
The first pronunciation is how our world's historical Alaric's name was pronounced, I think. But KK pronounces it the second way in her chapter readings.
Quote from: DerynifanK on February 13, 2023, 11:46:56 AMA LAR ic 3 syllables with emphasis on second syllable
AL aric 2 syllables with emphasis on first syllable.
I used the first pronunciation for decades until I finally heard KK in a reading pronouncing his name the second way. Now I tend to say it either way depending upon who I am talking to.
When I first read the novels, I pronounced it the first way, but then I heard someone talking about the Gothic warlord who sacked Rome in 410 AD, and they used the second pronunciation. So...AL-a-ric it became for me. Though sometimes I wonder if there's a third way-- the British might go with "AL'rik".
Much muttering of AL-a-ric to myself - under my breath as I am currently on a crowded train - suggests that this Brit at least would not entirely elide the middle syllable but would barely voice it in what I understand is known in phonetics as a schwa. "uh" rather than "a".
When I first started to read the books, having read them many years before, I used the first pronunciation and I find it really hard to change. I think the first one flows better with his full name, Alaric Anthony Morgan, than does the second one.
There is an important lady in the geniology list (she is not in one of the novels yet but I suspect she might make an apperance in Road to Killingford).
King Cluim Haldane, son of Uthyr Haldane, is married to Lady Swynbeth, daughter of Tammaron Duke of Cassan. She is important because she brings the liniage of Camber into the Haldane family tree.
I believe their pronunciations are:
Cluim = Kloom or Kloo-im
Swynbeth =
Swyn Origin and Meaning
The name Swyn is a Welsh girl's name meaning "charm, magic spell".
Which leads me to believe she carries some of those Deryni traits. but how to pronounce it? Certainly NOT "Swine" LOL. The computer says Swe-in-beth, and Soo-in-beth, I wanted to pronounce is Sv-ien-beth.
In my mind, I've pronounced the first syllable of Swynbeth like "swim," except with an N at the end instead of an M.
Quote from: DesertRose on February 27, 2023, 11:06:16 AMIn my mind, I've pronounced the first syllable of Swynbeth like "swim," except with an N at the end instead of an M.
I've always pronounced it this way too. I can't imagine why the computer is trying to read "Swyn-" as two syllables when it's much more logical to read this as a single syllable like in nearly all other words or names with the "wyn" letter combination (Gwynedd, Wyndham, Tammy Wynette, Nell Gwynne). In the case of Wynette there is a syllable break between the y and the n (Wy-nette), but there wouldn't logically be one there in Swynbeth. (In other words, no one would ever say Swy-nbeth, nor would we try to split up the w and y into separate syllables.) The only two possible ways for an English speaker to read the word would therefore either be as Swine-Beth or Swin-Beth (assuming the y isn't meant to have any pronunciation uncommon to English that might turn the name to something closer to Swoon-Beth), and I quite agree that the first option would be rather unfortunate for the poor lady to be stuck with, and one reliant on a foreign pronunciation of y unlikely, so I assume we're meant to go with the second option.
I think it may be a Welsh name, and W in Welsh orthography is sort of an "oo" sound (like the vowel in "smooth"), but even so it would be "soo-in", which would get slurred in normal conversational tones/speeds as "swin," to rhyme with "swim."
Alaric -- AL-ar-ic (source is Katherine Kurtz (https://www.rhemuthcastle.com/index.php/topic,2483.0.html))
Deryni -- mentioned above (https://www.rhemuthcastle.com/index.php/topic,1925.msg16222.html#msg16222) as Dare-IN-ee. Katherine Kurtz says "Der-in-ee" but says "Der- en i ... hard I" is also valid (source (https://www.rhemuthcastle.com/index.php/topic,2483.0.html))
Stefan -- STEF-an (source (https://www.rhemuthcastle.com/index.php?topic=2913.msg2744))
I hadn't noticed (although it is cited above) until watching a youtube video about medieval wales that the dd at the end of Gwynedd is pronounced as a th.
That's going to be a hard habit to break.
Quote from: drakensis on July 29, 2023, 02:04:45 AMI hadn't noticed (although it is cited above) until watching a youtube video about medieval wales that the dd at the end of Gwynedd is pronounced as a th.
That's going to be a hard habit to break.
Just put it down to local dialect and go with a "th" or a "d" at your pleasure.
dd is pronounced th in Welsh - at least its easier on English speakers than the Welsh ll which is like the ch in loch.
Quote from: revanne on July 29, 2023, 12:44:00 PMdd is pronounced th in Welsh - at least its easier on English speakers than the Welsh ll which is like the ch in loch.
So the correct pronunciation of Llannedd would be something like "Ch'an-eth?
That's...well...almost disturbing.
Quote from: DoctorM on July 29, 2023, 02:15:01 PMSo the correct pronunciation of Llannedd would be something like "Ch'an-eth?
That's...well...almost disturbing.
To pronounce the Welsh "LL," form your tongue like you're going to make the American
LL sound, but then breathe out both side of your tongue while you make the sound, so you're making a sound that's a cross between "ll" and "h." It's very breathy with only the barest hint of the "L" sound.
Quote from: Nezz on July 29, 2023, 02:19:42 PMQuote from: DoctorM on July 29, 2023, 02:15:01 PMSo the correct pronunciation of Llannedd would be something like "Ch'an-eth?
That's...well...almost disturbing.
And now I'll be up all night practicing this in the mirror.
To pronounce the Welsh "LL," form your tongue like you're going to make the American LL sound, but then breathe out both side of your tongue while you make the sound, so you're making a sound that's a cross between "ll" and "h." It's very breathy with only the barest hint of the "L" sound.
Did anyone ever tell the welsh that spelling is supposed to be phonetic? :P
Did anyone ever tell the English that spelling is supposed to be phonetic? People writing in English have absolutely no stones to throw; we're living in the Crystal Palace.
In its way, Welsh really is phonetic, more so than English! It just has very different orthography. Once you know the rules, things are pretty straightforward, unlike in English where things zigzag all over the place thanks to way too many languages sticking their fingers into the vocabulary.