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General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by whitelaughter on Today at 06:03:05 am »
If the stasis nets are (i) a considerable effort to make (and in addition to the effort involved, there's also the rarity of shiral to consider) and (ii) are maintaining an ongoing spell, then she probably has her own net. After all, the net is unlikely to be larger than necessary, and removing it will disrupt the spell (otherwise they would make multiples, they'd just reuse one).

Or of course, if the net can strengthen preservation spells, she may have been trying to use his net to strengthen a spell she was using to staunch her injury. She might even have succeeded, but only bought herself some more time, and died some time later.

Is the state of his body described? That would resolve it...unless 14 years was long enough to preserve the body sufficiently that the net was no longer needed.

Any chance she was trying to mindream his body to get knowledge she could use to save herself? I'd assume that at least one reason for the preservation spells was to lengthen the time doing so was practical.
Chat Logs / KK Chat - 22 October 2017
« Last post by Bynw on October 22, 2017, 07:35:05 pm »
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]* KK ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<Jemler> hi kk
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]* Evie_ is now known as Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<Desert_Rose> Hi KK
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<KK> Hello, all.
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<The_Bee> Hi DR. How are you doing now?
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<Derynifank> Hi KK
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<Desert_Rose> Meh
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<Evie> Hi
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]<The_Bee> Hi KK
[ 2017-10-22 18:10 ]* derynibot gives channel operator status to Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]* Desert_Rose has quit (Killed (bynw ("user requested kill")))
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]<bynw> oops
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]<KK> Meh?  How is the new apartment, now that you've had another week to settle in?
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]<bynw> wrong one
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]* DesertRose has quit (Killed (bynw ("user requested kill")))
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]* Desert_Rose ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:11 ]<KK> Meh?  How is the new apartment, now that you've had another week to settle in?
[ 2017-10-22 18:12 ]<Derynifank> Are we having tech difficult again
[ 2017-10-22 18:12 ]<bynw> DR was having some network trouble maybe she is good now or maybe not
[ 2017-10-22 18:13 ]<bynw> Desert_Rose, is that really you or another bad connection?
[ 2017-10-22 18:13 ]<Evie> I guess that answers that question
[ 2017-10-22 18:13 ]<Derynifank> DR hope things are looking up for you
[ 2017-10-22 18:14 ]<Jemler> KK, I'm sorry. I forgot to wish you a happy birthday last week.
[ 2017-10-22 18:15 ]<The_Bee> Yes, Happy Belated Birthday, KK
[ 2017-10-22 18:15 ]<KK> Thanks, Jemler.  How're you doing?
[ 2017-10-22 18:15 ]<bynw> yeah i think that is not really DR yet
[ 2017-10-22 18:16 ]<Jemler> i think i'm doing better, haven't been cuoghing as much.
[ 2017-10-22 18:16 ]<The_Bee> That's good to know
[ 2017-10-22 18:16 ]<Evie> Yes, Happy Birthday!
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* Desert_Rose is now known as DesertRose
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* DesertRose has quit (Changing hosts)
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* DesertRose (~DesertRose@DesertRose.Editor.Writer.Creator) has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* derynibot sets mode +q on #deryni_destinations DesertRose
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* derynibot gives channel operator status to DesertRose
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]* Derynifank has quit (Quit: - A hand crafted IRC client)
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]<Evie> Rehi DR
[ 2017-10-22 18:17 ]<DesertRose> No, this is the real me.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<DesertRose> I just stepped AFK for a minute.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<Jemler> but we lost derynifank.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<The_Bee> WB Dr.  hope you can stay this time
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<KK> Wow, the site reall doesn't like DR tonight.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<DesertRose> It's not the site.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<Jemler> last week was terrible.
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]* Derynifank ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<The_Bee> rehi DFK
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<Jemler> wb derynifank
[ 2017-10-22 18:18 ]<KK> Yes, last week was dire.
[ 2017-10-22 18:19 ]<KK> So, DR, how is the new apartment, now that you've had another week to settle in?
[ 2017-10-22 18:19 ]<Derynifank> Sorry to hear that
[ 2017-10-22 18:19 ]<DesertRose> I'm not settled in to the new apartment yet (will explain in a moment), and I'm at my parents' house, where the power flickers at the tiniest provocation (sometimes NO discernible provocation), and it's a bit rainy (nothing too bad), so the power flickered earlier today, which threw the router off, and it took a while for the internet to come back on.
[ 2017-10-22 18:20 ]<DesertRose> I was on a mobile hot spot for a while, and then it looked like the main network was back up but maybe not yet.
[ 2017-10-22 18:20 ]<The_Bee> OUCH!
[ 2017-10-22 18:20 ]<DesertRose> My stuff got moved to the new apartment last Friday, and then Friday evening, I realized that the little reddish tick-looking critters I kept finding on the bathroom floor were bed bugs.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<Jemler> finishing off the last of the spiced mead.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<KK> As if you needed that, on top of everything else.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<Derynifank> Oh no!
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<DesertRose> So I'm stuck at my parents' house until management gets THAT dealt with.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]* BalanceTheEnergies (BalanceTheE@45386A.7BC17F.6CF334.A4E60F) has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<DesertRose> Which is annoying for a multitude of reasons.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<DesertRose> Hi BalanceTheEnergies
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<Jemler> hi bte
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Hello sorry I'm late.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<KK> I hope they don't go into your stuff while management is futzing around.
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<Derynifank> As Charlie Brown would say, good grief
[ 2017-10-22 18:21 ]<DesertRose> I hope not.
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<DesertRose> I trust the maintenance people to leave my stuff alone.
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<DesertRose> Management themselves. . .
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]* The_Bee sends DR anti-bedbug woodgies and other apart-cleaning helpers
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<KK> I meant the bedbugs.
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<Jemler> go old school: zoinks!
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<KK> They can hide in incredibly tiny spaces.
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<DesertRose> Oh.  Well, management has fumigated once, and hopefully will fumigate again soon.
[ 2017-10-22 18:22 ]<Derynifank> Is there a good deryni spell for getting  rid of pests?
[ 2017-10-22 18:23 ]<Evie> That would be handy. :-)
[ 2017-10-22 18:23 ]<KK> Indeed.  Wee beasties were an all too comon part of medieval life.
[ 2017-10-22 18:23 ]<Jemler> if there was it didn't work on loris! :)
[ 2017-10-22 18:23 ]<The_Bee> or Hubert
[ 2017-10-22 18:23 ]<Derynifank> It has stayed warm here so get attacked by mosquitos  every time I go out
[ 2017-10-22 18:24 ]<KK> Yuck!
[ 2017-10-22 18:24 ]<The_Bee> If Melantha doesn't eat her food right away, i find bugs in it.
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<DesertRose> But there's no point in moving to a new unit AGAIN since this one is infested, because chances are fair to middling the little [bleeps] would hitch a ride.
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]* JudyWard ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<DesertRose> Hi JudyWard
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<Jemler> hi judyward
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<The_Bee> Hi Judy
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<Evie> Deryni homes would be flea and louse free. Unless they knew the likes of a Loris was about, in which case they might put up with a few fleas for safety's sake.  :-D
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Hello Judy
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<JudyWard> Hi, Bee & DR & Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<Derynifank> Hi Judy
[ 2017-10-22 18:25 ]<JudyWard> hi df
[ 2017-10-22 18:26 ]<JudyWard> eating while chatting
[ 2017-10-22 18:26 ]<DesertRose> I am SERIOUSLY unimpressed at this point, though, because now it looks like I'll have paid October rent and not have been able to sleep in the building for the majority of the month.
[ 2017-10-22 18:26 ]<KK> I should think that an adjustment in your rent is in order.
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<DesertRose> And I honestly wouldn't put it past the assistant manager and/or the manager to have given me that unit knowing it was infested, but that's a whole different story.
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<DesertRose> It's already income based.
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<Derynifank> I think they definitely  owe you a refund or no rent for November
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<KK> I agree.
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<JudyWard> yes
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> What about local ordinances on such things?
[ 2017-10-22 18:27 ]<The_Bee> me too, but don't hold your breath
[ 2017-10-22 18:28 ]<DesertRose> And I haven't gotten around to speaking to the headquarters about the bed bug problem yet because I spent last Saturday through this past Tuesday in the hospital and I haven't really bounced back from that yet, plus I had other stuff to do Thursday and Friday that tied up the entire day.
[ 2017-10-22 18:28 ]<KK> In the hospital?  Oh, no!  You didn't need that.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<The_Bee> Was it your digestion?
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]* JudyWard has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC)
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<DesertRose> I basically had a nervous breakdown Friday-Saturday.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> I hope you're feeling better.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<KK> From the bedbugs?  That definitely rates a rent refund.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<DesertRose> Not really.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]* JudyWard ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<DesertRose> Well, the bed bugs were the last straw.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<KK> Exactly.
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<The_Bee> wb Judy
[ 2017-10-22 18:29 ]<JudyWard> What happened??? I got ejected!
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<DesertRose> I've been stressed out of my mind for months/a couple of years, TBH.
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<Evie> The server has been acting up the past couple of Sundays, JudyWard.
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<Jemler> Evie, file sizes for Maidens of Mayhem
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<Jemler> PDF  952,401 bytes
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<Jemler> EPUB 428,111 bytes
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<Jemler> TXT  477,392 bytes
[ 2017-10-22 18:30 ]<bynw> hard to say judy, nothing in the quit message indicated an issue other than the browser window closed
[ 2017-10-22 18:31 ]<JudyWard> hi jemler
[ 2017-10-22 18:31 ]<DesertRose> And Wednesday, I called the housing authority main office about the fact that I couldn't sleep in my own home, and they told me to go to the building and address it with them.
[ 2017-10-22 18:31 ]<Evie> OK, Jemler. Thx.
[ 2017-10-22 18:31 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Perhaps there are city or county authorities to be involved. Here there's city inspectors and properties need to be certified habitable.
[ 2017-10-22 18:31 ]<Derynifank> Sometimes I think the server  is inhabited by an evil spirit,
[ 2017-10-22 18:32 ]<DesertRose> Without going into a long drawn-out rant, it did NOT end well (Asst. Mgr. was a total jerk, basically), so I wound up at the main office, to be told that I had never put in any work orders about the leaking window in the old unit, which is utter nonsense, because I sure as hell have, repeatedly.
[ 2017-10-22 18:32 ]<The_Bee> It sounds like you're getting the runaround, DR
[ 2017-10-22 18:32 ]<Jemler> evie could ask Duncan to perform an excorsism.
[ 2017-10-22 18:33 ]<DesertRose> The authority president wound up involved, as did the relevant senior vice president, and they sent a contractor to inspect the old unit; the contractor's conclusion was that the old unit wasn't habitable, so they had to move me to another unit, and then, as if moving weren't stressful enough, I don't even get to start taking things out of boxes before I find out about the infestation.
[ 2017-10-22 18:33 ]<Derynifank> If this is city housing you should be able to go to the  housing authority
[ 2017-10-22 18:33 ]<DesertRose> And I just haven't gotten around to getting back with the housing authority main office since I got out of the hospital Tuesday evening.
[ 2017-10-22 18:33 ]<Derynifank> Oops, sounds like you already did that
[ 2017-10-22 18:34 ]<DesertRose> Wednesday I was exhausted and didn't really do anything, and Thursday and Friday, I had medical appointments that, with errands added, tied up basically the entirety of both days.
[ 2017-10-22 18:34 ]<DesertRose> But I can certainly call them tomorrow, and I'm going to try.
[ 2017-10-22 18:34 ]<The_Bee> Is there someone who can knock heads on your behalf?
[ 2017-10-22 18:34 ]<DesertRose> If all else fails, I'll get my parents involved.
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<KK> Yes, there have to be protections in place, especially for tenants whose health is already precarious.  Are you a senior?  There must be senior advocate-type people whose job is to run interference in caseds like this.
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<DesertRose> My stepdad looks really unassuming, until you make him angry enough.
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<DesertRose> No, I'm not a senior, but I am disabled, so I should be able to find some help somewhere if they can't get their seabags stenciled here.
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<KK> Sounds like you could maybe draft him for assistance, to run interference for you.
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<JudyWard> sic him pn them
[ 2017-10-22 18:35 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> I only mention the authorities because I live in a privately-owned building that has to be certified (and inspected) periodically
[ 2017-10-22 18:36 ]<DesertRose> Well, as to the old unit, there's already a fair chance that FEMA will want to take a look, because I filed with FEMA for disaster relief benefits (I was actually hoping to get reimbursed for my evacuation expenses).
[ 2017-10-22 18:36 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> I wonder if they too have some credentials they might lose...
[ 2017-10-22 18:37 ]<DesertRose> But when I did the interview/application with FEMA, they did ask about home damage and I did tell them, and I was told that an inspection was a possibility.
[ 2017-10-22 18:37 ]<KK> That sounds hopeful.
[ 2017-10-22 18:37 ]<DesertRose> Well, they could lose their HUD funding, but that'd almost be cutting off my nose to spite my face, because then I'd have to move (and change my address with everyone under the sun) AGAIN and at this point, I'd stand a fair chance of having unwanted "hitchhikers" tag along for the move.
[ 2017-10-22 18:38 ]<Derynifank> I asked my daughter who works in city gov'the as a planner and she said you can complain to HD because that who funds them,nor if you have a local TV station that does investigation  they might get a reaction from the
[ 2017-10-22 18:38 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> The threat might light a fire under them though.
[ 2017-10-22 18:39 ]<Derynifank> HI D
[ 2017-10-22 18:39 ]<DesertRose> I don't want to complain to HUD yet, but it's a thought if they don't get it sorted ASAP.
[ 2017-10-22 18:39 ]<JudyWard> You've had such a hard time with this, so get any help you can.
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<DesertRose> I'm a bit tired of sleeping on the day bed in the front bedroom/office (it's not very nice to my back), and I HATE that every time I have to go over to the new unit to get something, I can't [bleeping] find anything because I never really got around to taking things out of boxes and putting them where they ought to be.
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<DesertRose> Well, it's also a matter of energy, JudyWard.
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<Derynifank> Do you have a local media outlet  that does investigations ? They might get results
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<JudyWard> As in you don't have any?
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<DesertRose> And my parents (along with my therapist and half the rest of the world) seem to think that I'm still the person I was two years ago when my meds were working and my digestive tract was behaving.
[ 2017-10-22 18:40 ]<DesertRose> Yup
[ 2017-10-22 18:41 ]<The_Bee> If you do have a local tv station with an investigative team, you might want to keep them in mind.  especially if other tenants are having problems
[ 2017-10-22 18:41 ]<DesertRose> I don't know.  I so seldom watch TV that I honestly haven't a clue, but it'd be easy enough to search online.
[ 2017-10-22 18:41 ]<JudyWard> It's hard enough to deal with poor health, much less this mess on top of it.
[ 2017-10-22 18:41 ]* bynw hopes his move doesnt have any issues
[ 2017-10-22 18:41 ]<DesertRose> Yeah, one of my (now former) neighbors on my old floor mentioned that he's suing them, although he didn't say on what grounds.
[ 2017-10-22 18:42 ]<DesertRose> He's been annoyed basically the whole time he's lived in the building, but he hasn't been there that long, so the only management he knows is the condescending jerk who can't spell or otherwise construct a grammatical sentence who is the current manager.
[ 2017-10-22 18:42 ]<bynw> sounds like that place is very poorly managed
[ 2017-10-22 18:42 ]<Jemler> the management saw the bedbugs and "no pets"
[ 2017-10-22 18:42 ]<Derynifank> It's really rough trying to deal with all of this  and resolve health issues  too. Wish I could help
[ 2017-10-22 18:42 ]<DesertRose> We've had significantly better managers in the past.
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<The_Bee> At least try to find out if there's a local I-Team.
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<JudyWard> Managers can be very good, but sounds like this guy is not.
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<DesertRose> And the old assistant manager was MUCH more pleasant, polite, and professional than the current one, although the former assistant was here for the earlier part of Jerk Manager's time.
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> True Judy. I've had both sorts.
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<JudyWard> I was blessed with good managers when I lived in apts, so, so long ago
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<DesertRose> I found out from Former Assistant that our building is used as a training property by the housing authority, since all the units are the same size and all the tenants are adults (she was actually training for promotion along the management career path).
[ 2017-10-22 18:43 ]<Derynifank> Maybe we could sic Loris and Gorony  on him
[ 2017-10-22 18:44 ]<JudyWard> Oh, definitely Gorony. And tell him they are all Deryni.
[ 2017-10-22 18:44 ]<Derynifank> Good idea Judy
[ 2017-10-22 18:44 ]<DesertRose> You know, I'd actually wish Loris and Gorony and Hubert and Rhun and Wencit and Charissa and Teymuraz and basically every Black Hat in the whole Deryniverse, plus the Lodge of the Lynx from the Adept series, on this lot.
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<DesertRose> And that's saying a LOT.
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<JudyWard> They deserve it.
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> oh wow.
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<Derynifank> I'M with you DR
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<KK> What a nightmare!  Wish I could help.  But it's been decades since I lived in rental accommodations, so I know little about the realities of dealing with such folk.  I do know that if one of the tetenants in our (small) apartment building has a problem, my building manager is on it like a shot.  (She's worth every penny of her 10% management fee.) 
[ 2017-10-22 18:45 ]<DesertRose> Plus, Jerk Manager and Jerk New Assistant Manager are Bible-thumpers of the hypocritical sort, so I'd just sit back and watch with schadenfreude-tinged glee at the bonfire.
[ 2017-10-22 18:46 ]<DesertRose> I've actually mostly had good or at least decent landlords most of my life too.
[ 2017-10-22 18:46 ]<JudyWard> Good to have good management when you have property.
[ 2017-10-22 18:46 ]<DesertRose> And this building was well managed until THIS sufferer of MASSIVE craniorectal inversion came along.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<JudyWard> Maybe he'll be gone soon. He absolutely will be if he causes the owners problems.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<KK> Sounds like you need to go after his job, if he's that incompetent.  You can't be the only one having problems with him.  (There's at least the one who's suing.)
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<DesertRose> It's also not maintenance's fault, and I made sure to let the headquarters bunch know that, just in case Capt. Craniorectal Inversion tries to hang the maintenance supervisor and/or his staff out to dry.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<DesertRose> Oh, everyone hates him.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> That can happen. I once lived in a building that was sold. New managers sucked.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<Derynifank> Is this city or privately owned  property?
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<DesertRose> Or everyone to whom I've spoken about him.
[ 2017-10-22 18:47 ]<DesertRose> City/county.
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<The_Bee> My minister today said something about people who are Christian enough to feel superior, but not enough to be kind.
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]* Jerusha ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<Jemler> hi jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<The_Bee> hi Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Hello Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<JudyWard> Hi, Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<Jerusha> Hi Everyone!
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<Derynifank> Hi Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<DesertRose> Which isn't much of a distinction where I live, since the entirety of the county with the exception of four small municipalities (the three "beaches" plus one little settlement in the northwestern corner of the county) is incorporated into the city.
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<DesertRose> Hi Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 18:48 ]<Jerusha> Sorry to be late; family dinner and puppy playtime
[ 2017-10-22 18:49 ]<DesertRose> You faithless, truant wretch!  Leaving us behind for FAMILY and PUPPY!!! :D
[ 2017-10-22 18:49 ]* Jerusha hangs head in shame
[ 2017-10-22 18:49 ]<Jemler> you set up puppy pkaydates?
[ 2017-10-22 18:49 ]<Derynifank> Who can compete with a puppy?
[ 2017-10-22 18:49 ]<Jerusha> They invade and pull out all of the toys
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<JudyWard> Puppies are irresistible.
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]* Jemler sings 'Puppy love'
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> that'd do it
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<Jerusha> Cute beyond compare
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<Jemler> way better than CATS!
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<DesertRose> Oh, speaking of puppies, anyone who's on Facebook, there's a FB page called UPS Dogs (facebook dot com slash UPSDOGS) which consists of UPS (and other parcel/post services) delivery drivers with the dogs (and occasionally other critters) they meet in the course of their jobs.
[ 2017-10-22 18:50 ]<DesertRose> HEY!!!  Watch your mouth, Jemler!  :P
[ 2017-10-22 18:51 ]<JudyWard> Kittens are irresistible, too.
[ 2017-10-22 18:51 ]<Jemler> da-da-da-d-d-dah Puppy Power!
[ 2017-10-22 18:51 ]<KK> Yeah, Jemler, you're surrounded by cat people (some of whom also happen to be dog people).
[ 2017-10-22 18:51 ]<Derynifank> Jemler has obviously never played with a cute kitten
[ 2017-10-22 18:51 ]<DesertRose> A recent one from the UPS Dogs page involved a horse who decided to come up and make friends with the UPS driver.
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<JudyWard> Yep, we do dogs and cats.
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<JudyWard> Or cat, nowadays..
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<KK> Yeah, dogs and cats mostly play completely differently.
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<Jerusha> No cats, alas, DS3 is allergic
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<DesertRose> And another photo showed, of all things, a LEMUR hanging off the back of the truck!
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<DesertRose> I like dogs and cats, but my living situation isn't all that dog-friendly.
[ 2017-10-22 18:52 ]<JudyWard> A lemur????
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<The_Bee> There's a movement here to make pet stores to sell only rescue animals.  The objective is to shut down the puppy mills.
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<Jerusha> Cute but not your normal pet
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<KK> You know: huge eyes, long tails....
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<Derynifank> Besides dogs can'take purr, a real disadvantage
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]* Jemler sings 'Hound dog' and 'How much is that houng dog in the window'
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<JudyWard> I'll need to go feed our outside kitties before it gets dark.
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<DesertRose> A 500-square-foot flat isn't much space for a dog, and the building's stairwells are meant to be fire escapes, and the elevators are notoriously unreliable, so I'd hate to put a dog in that situation.
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<Evie> I need to go. There's a possible break-in at my MIL's home, and I need to try to reach my DH.
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]* Evie has quit (Quit: Life without danger is a waste of oxygen)
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<DesertRose> Yes, Bee.  A number of our local pet shops have done that on their own.
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> uh oh Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<Jerusha> Eek!  Be safe, Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:53 ]<JudyWard> Hope all is OK, Evie
[ 2017-10-22 18:54 ]<The_Bee> be safe, be okay
[ 2017-10-22 18:54 ]<Derynifank> Be careful Evie hope all is well
[ 2017-10-22 18:55 ]<DesertRose> I used to volunteer at the PetSmart up here by my parents' house (when I actually lived here), taking care of the cats for adoption there, who were shelter cats from the humane society the next county north (my parents live on the far north end of our county, so it's not that far).
[ 2017-10-22 18:55 ]<DesertRose> And all the local PetSmart stores have only shelter pets in their adoptable pet area (although I'm not sure about critters like hamsters, gerbils, and guinea pigs); but the cats and dogs are all shelter critters.
[ 2017-10-22 18:55 ]<KK> Our nearest PetSmart does adoption days of rescue critters just about every Saturday.
[ 2017-10-22 18:56 ]<The_Bee> I believe Petco also has adoption days
[ 2017-10-22 18:56 ]<JudyWard> We have a PetCo not very far away that has adoptions on Sundays.
[ 2017-10-22 18:56 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> My local vet also hosts pets for adoption from the local ARL.
[ 2017-10-22 18:56 ]<DesertRose> Yeah, they do adoption fairs with more critters from a variety of shelters, but in each store, there's a permanent area for pets for sale, and all the ones in there are from one shelter/rescue organization or another.
[ 2017-10-22 18:56 ]<KK> I think that is maybe becoming the norm.  There's only one pet store in the local area that has pets, mostly dogs, for sale from breeders.
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<bynw> i have a cousin that rescues dogs, she has adopted a few of them
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<DesertRose> And also, there's a big pet adoption extravaganza at the fairgrounds (which is dead in the center of town, which seems odd to me; I'm used to fairgrounds being on the outskirts) every few months.
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<JudyWard> When we had puppies, they were all sold by referral & contract.
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<The_Bee> Melantha came from a shelter.  not surewhereshe lived befoare, but she had to be treated for ear-mites.
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<KK> I've transported 2 rescues in the past week, and they want me to do another one this week.
[ 2017-10-22 18:57 ]<DesertRose> The big ones at the fairgrounds involve basically every shelter for a couple of counties around.
[ 2017-10-22 18:58 ]<DesertRose> My friend Joyce does that, KK, transports shelter critters.  She also has a minor menagerie of her own.
[ 2017-10-22 18:58 ]<JudyWard> My BFF Gala & I do home inspections for Rhodesian Ridgeback rescue.
[ 2017-10-22 18:58 ]<DesertRose> Aw. I bet that's fun, JudyWard.
[ 2017-10-22 18:58 ]<bynw> my current kitties are the only ones i have ever purchased from a breeder. all the ones in the past were either strays or "hey do you want a kitten"
[ 2017-10-22 18:58 ]<Jerusha> You have Rhodesians, JudyWard?
[ 2017-10-22 18:59 ]<JudyWard> It's IS fun & usually the are approved. Had one last weekend that I wanted to adopt ME.
[ 2017-10-22 18:59 ]<JudyWard> Yes, since 1988, Jerusha.
[ 2017-10-22 18:59 ]<Jerusha> They have lovely faces
[ 2017-10-22 18:59 ]<DesertRose> I have an online friend who has a rescue greyhound (retired racer).  He was terrified out of his mind when she and her husband adopted him.  Now he is the biggest, silliest, goofiest, laziest-yet-fastest-when-he's-a-mind-to-be dog EVER.
[ 2017-10-22 18:59 ]<DesertRose> LOL, JudyWard
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<JudyWard> Yes, they do. They're tricksy, though, as Gollum would say.
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<DesertRose> All of mine have been rescues, one way or another.
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<JudyWard> Racing greyhounds are great pets, too.
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<bynw> tricksy like hobbitses
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<DesertRose> The only pets I've ever purchased were hamsters.
[ 2017-10-22 19:00 ]<The_Bee> Are Rhodesians large dogs?
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<bynw> i dont think i even purchased those DR
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<JudyWard> Yes, 65 to 85 lbs usually.
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<Jerusha> I've only had one rescue, a Boxer.  She came to visit for a weekend and stayed for 14 years
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<DesertRose> LOL, Jerusha
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<DesertRose> As my mom says, no such thing as a temporary pet.
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<JudyWard> Nice long visit!
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<DesertRose>
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<Jerusha> DH just shook his head
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<JudyWard> BRB, have to feed the outside kitties before it's dark.
[ 2017-10-22 19:01 ]<DesertRose> Okay, JudyWard
[ 2017-10-22 19:02 ]<DesertRose> PJ was supposed to hang with my parents until they could find her a forever home.
[ 2017-10-22 19:02 ]<DesertRose> That was June.
[ 2017-10-22 19:02 ]<DesertRose> 2010
[ 2017-10-22 19:03 ]<DesertRose> I'd say she's a permanent member of the household now.  :)
[ 2017-10-22 19:03 ]<Jerusha> Yep
[ 2017-10-22 19:04 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> one of my vet's assistants has done the same several times--at least three dogs and a cat.
[ 2017-10-22 19:04 ]<DesertRose> That's how it goes.  :)
[ 2017-10-22 19:04 ]* Eyikl ( has joined
[ 2017-10-22 19:04 ]<Jerusha> Hi Eyiki
[ 2017-10-22 19:04 ]<The_Bee> Hi Eyiki
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<bynw> hi Eyikl
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<Derynifank> Several of my pets came via my daughters  who kept finding them and bringing them home once had 5 cats and 2 dogs
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<JudyWard> Mission accomplished. Cats are fed.
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Hello Eyikl
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<JudyWard> Hi, Eyiki.
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<Eyikl> Hi everybody
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<Jerusha> Fed cats are happy
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<Derynifank> Hi Eyikl
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<JudyWard> Fed dogs, too.
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<Jerusha> Purr-manently
[ 2017-10-22 19:05 ]<DesertRose> Hi Eyikl
[ 2017-10-22 19:06 ]<Jemler> hi eyikl
[ 2017-10-22 19:06 ]<DesertRose> Yeah, PJ and Merlin are both my daughter's fault, and the previous pair of family cats were basically my fault.
[ 2017-10-22 19:06 ]<Jerusha> There are worse things to be at fault for
[ 2017-10-22 19:07 ]<DesertRose> Catarina we adopted Christmas 1988 because I begged and begged for a kitty, and Roxanne we adopted two years later because my stepdad decided Catarina was lonely.
[ 2017-10-22 19:07 ]<JudyWard> My DB1 & his wife have had only pets brought there by their son over the last 14 yrs or so.
[ 2017-10-22 19:07 ]<DesertRose> We also think that Catarina may not have realized she was a cat until Roxie joined the family.
[ 2017-10-22 19:08 ]<JudyWard> Probably really thought she was human.
[ 2017-10-22 19:08 ]<Jemler> i'm assuming DB means Dear Brother, and not Dead Beat!
[ 2017-10-22 19:08 ]<DesertRose> Catarina was an orphaned kitten, who was MAYBE 4-5 weeks old when we got her, so she missed out on some Kitten-garden training from Mama Kitty.
[ 2017-10-22 19:08 ]<JudyWard> Dear Brother. <G>
[ 2017-10-22 19:08 ]<DesertRose> *garten  I just realized that kindergarten is German and I spelled it wrong.  Oops.
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<DesertRose> Good news from Kiddo!  She passed her LPN licensing exam!
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<The_Bee> Cool!
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<Jerusha> Excellent!
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Congrats
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<Derynifank> Tell her congrats!
[ 2017-10-22 19:09 ]<JudyWard> Congratulations!
[ 2017-10-22 19:10 ]<Eyikl> Yay!
[ 2017-10-22 19:10 ]<Jerusha> Now hopefully she can find a good position
[ 2017-10-22 19:10 ]<DesertRose> We live in Florida.
[ 2017-10-22 19:10 ]<DesertRose> One thing we NEVER run short of is medical-profession jobs.
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<Derynifank> Where in Florida?
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<DesertRose> Everyone and their cousin retires here, or if they're well-off enough, has a winter home here.
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<JudyWard> Nurses are in great demand.
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<KK> Excellent!  Well done, that Kiddo!
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<DesertRose> Jacksonville.
[ 2017-10-22 19:11 ]<JudyWard> Jax to the natives there.
[ 2017-10-22 19:12 ]<Jemler> one of the nurses at the dialysis clinic i got to recently retired, to florida.
[ 2017-10-22 19:12 ]<DesertRose> Although she's thinking of moving to Orlando to get a job there and start the bridge-to-RN program in Orlando (might be at UCF, but not sure), because the program in ORL will allow her to enroll right now, basically, whereas the one up here requires not just the LPN license but six months relevant work experience to enroll.
[ 2017-10-22 19:12 ]<JudyWard> She can find lots of part time work if she wants it.
[ 2017-10-22 19:13 ]<DesertRose> Which would end up costing her a year out of school because of deadlines for applying for any given semester.
[ 2017-10-22 19:13 ]<Jerusha> It's easier to continue on with the schooling than go back for it
[ 2017-10-22 19:13 ]<JudyWard> I've heard private sitting is very well-paying, too.
[ 2017-10-22 19:13 ]<DesertRose> Yes
[ 2017-10-22 19:14 ]<DesertRose> Studying is a habit that it's easy to forget.
[ 2017-10-22 19:14 ]<Jerusha> I have tried to forget many times.... :)
[ 2017-10-22 19:14 ]<Jemler> evie isn't back yet?
[ 2017-10-22 19:14 ]<JudyWard> I always meant to go back to college but never did.
[ 2017-10-22 19:14 ]<JudyWard> How far did Evie have to go?
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> not sure Judy
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<Derynifank> LPS to RN program a great idea , hope it works out for her. I had a friend who started as an LOL and ended up as a nurse anesthetist with a master's degree. One thing about nursint, it had great upward mobility
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<Jemler> i just read about the break-in.
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<Jerusha> Hope she's not taking on a burglar by herself!
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<The_Bee> She may be dealing with police.
[ 2017-10-22 19:15 ]<Derynifank> Started ad LPS
[ 2017-10-22 19:16 ]<DesertRose> I would assume she and DH are dealing with the local constabulary.
[ 2017-10-22 19:16 ]<Derynifank> This darn thing keeps changing my N  to an S, crazy
[ 2017-10-22 19:17 ]<JudyWard> Figured you mean LPS or LPN not LOL. <G>
[ 2017-10-22 19:17 ]<DesertRose> Evie's MIL's house is not very far from Evie's, but they may be up to their eyebrows in figuring out what happened and attending to the paperwork.
[ 2017-10-22 19:17 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> the dubious joys of autocorrect
[ 2017-10-22 19:17 ]<DesertRose> The bridge program here (and I think also in Orlando) will allow someone with either an LPN license or a paramedic license to continue to RN without having to repeat classes they would have already taken as part of the certification they already have.
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<JudyWard> That's good.
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<Jerusha> That sounds good
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<DesertRose> And Kiddo's eventual plan is to become some sort of nurse practitioner, but she hasn't decided which field yet.
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<Derynifank> Yeah, auto correct thinks it knows better than I do what I want to say
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<DesertRose> She has time.  She'll have to get the RN, the BSN, and probably be in progress with the MSN before she has to worry about specialty.
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<Jerusha> Sounds like a good plan, DF
[ 2017-10-22 19:18 ]<Jerusha> DR, I meant
[ 2017-10-22 19:20 ]<Derynifank> She should be able to do LPS to BSN
[ 2017-10-22 19:20 ]<DesertRose> I'm not sure if they'll let you in Florida, at least not at the public universities.
[ 2017-10-22 19:20 ]<JudyWard> Very good career.
[ 2017-10-22 19:20 ]<Derynifank> Grr. It did it again
[ 2017-10-22 19:20 ]<DesertRose> Which are FAR less expensive than private ones.
[ 2017-10-22 19:21 ]<DesertRose> I don't think any BSN program will take an LPN with no work experience, anyway.
[ 2017-10-22 19:22 ]<DesertRose> And if she's got to get work experience, she may as well get her RN, which will make it easier to win admission to a BSN program.
[ 2017-10-22 19:22 ]<Jemler> what's a bsn?
[ 2017-10-22 19:22 ]<The_Bee> drowning in alphabet soup here, BSN? LPS?
[ 2017-10-22 19:22 ]<JudyWard> Batchelor of Science Nursing
[ 2017-10-22 19:23 ]<The_Bee> someone who nurses scientists?
[ 2017-10-22 19:23 ]<JudyWard> LPN is Licensed Practical Nurse
[ 2017-10-22 19:23 ]<JudyWard> LOL, Bee
[ 2017-10-22 19:23 ]<DesertRose> LPS is Derynifank's autocorrect trying not to let DFK say LPN, which is Licensed Practical Nurse, which is a nursing job a step below RN (registered nurse).
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<DesertRose> LPNs can't give certain medications and there are a few other things RNs can do that LPNs can't.
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> At times, I presume scientists needs nursing.
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<JudyWard> My SIL with DB1 is a graduate RN. Now accumulating initial behind her RN
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<Derynifank> LPS was supposed to be LPN. This is driving me crazy
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<Jerusha> I would blame Loris
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<DesertRose> BSN is Bachelor of Science in Nursing, which is a higher degree of study than RN (and often entails a higher pay rate), and MSN is Master of Science in Nursing.
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<JudyWard> It would be just like him to do.
[ 2017-10-22 19:24 ]<Derynifank> Absolutely
[ 2017-10-22 19:25 ]<DesertRose> Most people who get an MSN are looking to become either nursing supervisor or nurse practitioners, of which there are several certifications.
[ 2017-10-22 19:25 ]<Derynifank> They can also teach in schools of nursing
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<KK> OOOp, Scott just got back from D.C., dropping off a friend at Reagan Airport, and is bursting with news, so I gotta go.
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<The_Bee> At least some LPs can write prescriptions
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<The_Bee> Bye KK. Glad you came
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<JudyWard> Bye KK, have a good week.
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<DesertRose> There's CNM, which is certified nurse midwife (basically a nurse practitioner in the obstetrics/gynecology field), CRNA (certified registered nurse anesthetist), which is a nurse practitioner in anesthesiology, and ARNP (advanced registered nurse practitioner), which is sort of a catch-all for everything else.
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<Jerusha> Glad you could join us, KK
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<Derynifank> By KK
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<DesertRose> Bye, KK!  Thanks for coming to see us!  Will we see you next week?
[ 2017-10-22 19:26 ]<BalanceTheEnergies> Good night KK thanks for coming.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<The_Bee> have a good week, KK.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<Eyikl> Goodnight KK
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<DesertRose> And there may be other subtypes of nurse practitioner, too.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<Jerusha> That's a lot of specialties
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<Jerusha> Nighters, KK
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<DesertRose> LPNs can't write prescriptions at all, nor can RNs.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<Derynifank> There are also pediatric NAS
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<KK> See you guys next week.  And DR, hope you can get your housing sorted with a minimum of further frustration.  I don't want to hear about a dark-haired lady berserking at an apartment manager because he's pushed her over the edge!  ;-)
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<DesertRose> They can administer them, but they can't write them.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<DesertRose> Nurse practitioners can, though, although in some states they can't write certain types of controlled substance prescritpions.
[ 2017-10-22 19:27 ]<DesertRose> LOL
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<DesertRose> Already did that, sort of, last week
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]* KK steps onto her Portal, waves goodnight, and disappears in a shower of green sparkles.
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<DesertRose> I flipped out and had a crying, screaming panic attack on the housing authority headquarters front lawn/in the parking lot.
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<Jerusha> Oh dear
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<The_Bee> My LPN writes my psychiatric prescriptions.
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<KK> Well, then, do it again, if you have to.  But stand up for your rights.  And call in the Big Guns!
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<DesertRose> Which was what got the president involved.  My voice CARRIES, particularly when I'm not trying to keep my voice down.
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<JudyWard> Oh, no! So sorry they put you in that condition!
[ 2017-10-22 19:28 ]<Derynifank> Nurse practitioners  can write prescriptions they have at least a master's degree and state certification
[ 2017-10-22 19:29 ]<DesertRose> No, that's not an LPN, Bee.
[ 2017-10-22 19:29 ]<The_Bee> oops, I meant nurse practioner
[ 2017-10-22 19:29 ]<DesertRose> Might be some other bit of alphabet soup, but LPNs can't even administer certain medications, let alone prescribe them.
[ 2017-10-22 19:29 ]<KK> I'd say you had justificatio, DR!
[ 2017-10-22 19:29 ]<KK> Ta-ta for now.  Have a good week, all.
[ 2017-10-22 19:30 ]<Derynifank> Keep after them DR
[ 2017-10-22 19:30 ]<JudyWard> You, too.
[ 2017-10-22 19:30 ]<DesertRose> Thanks!  See you next week!  You have a good week too!
[ 2017-10-22 19:30 ]<Jerusha> Bye, KK
[ 2017-10-22 19:30 ]* KK has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
Birthday Wishes / Re: Happy Birthday KK!
« Last post by jemler on October 22, 2017, 05:18:58 pm »
Hope you had a happy birthday! Things were so screwy on chat last week, I completely forgot to tell you!
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by DesertRose on October 22, 2017, 04:59:04 pm »
Good points, both.

And yes, I have to imagine that making a silk net beaded with itty-bitty shiral crystals and large enough to cover an adult human on a bier is probably a fairly time-consuming undertaking (having done enough fiber/textile craft myself), but perhaps the Airsid or some allied group makes them just to have handy in the event of the death of somebody important enough to be thus preserved.  After all, a lot of deaths (then and now, reality or fantasy) don't always come with a lot of warning.

It really could go either way; if Orin's net is big enough, it could be that Jodotha pulled the edge over herself as she died, and if not, it could be that someone close to Jodotha (Airsid initiates, students, whatever) made a practice of keeping a few stasis nets on hand and they grabbed one to drape over her when her remains were found with Orin's.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by revanne on October 22, 2017, 04:35:17 pm »
I've always envisaged her as draping the hanging edge of Orin's net over herself just as Evie suggests, both as an act of homage (echoes of touching the hem of his garment) and as a last comfort.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by Evie on October 22, 2017, 04:18:46 pm »
I think if someone had found Jodotha and covered her with a second net, she would have decomposed more fully before the net was completed, unless someone just happened to have a spiral net premade already. I read the passage as meaning that Jodotha went to Orin's tomb knowing she was mortally wounded and wanting to die beside her beloved teacher, and because she was lying on the ground beside a high bier, it would have been easy enough to pull the trailing edge of Orin's net over herself without having to uncover him (and thereby remove its protection from him) at all. It would be like lying next to a table with a tablecloth on it whose edges touch or even pool on the ground on all sides.  You could easily pull just the hanging edge over yourself without disturbing anything on the table. I think she probably used the portal to get there, and as to why she didn't save that energy to Heal herself instead, it could be that she didn't have anything left to live for at that point. Even if she'd managed to survive, where would she flee to? Court wouldn't be a safe place for her, and any other home she might have would not remain a safe haven for long. Or it could just be that she knew she was bleeding out and getting weak too quickly to retain the necessary focus for such deep Healing on herself, but she had just enough focus left for one remaining Portal jump.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by DesertRose on October 22, 2017, 02:32:33 pm »
Thank you for looking it up DR. I hadn't had time to do so yet.

That is very intriguing question, DR. Perhaps someone made Jobotha her own Shiral net, but then why would they not have laid her out on her own bier next to Orin's.

If Jodotha tried to clear the two princes of wrongful charges, then it seems to me that she would have been mortally wounded by the person or the person's conspirator who wanted to see the two young men removed as heirs to the kingdom. The new young wife is therefore highly suspect. The question then remains if Jodotha ever got a chance to make a plea to the king or if she was wounded before she could let out the truth.  She, herself, was a healer, so it had to be a very fatal wound. Yet one she managed to stave off long enough to get to Orin's tomb. But why go to Orin's tomb? Was she looking for solace from Orin's spirit, like that of cambers spirit. or was she looking for the black protocol that she may have guessed, or known, was buried with Orin.

So many questions left unanswered.

Well, if Jodotha has her own stasis net, it could be that whoever made it/had it made and placed it there found her body next to Orin's bier long enough after death that rigor mortis had set in (but [TMI re dead bodies ahead] obviously not too long after death, else the body would not be so well preserved by the time Evaine, Joram, and Queron find them), and rigor mortis would make it difficult to maneuver the corpse into a suitable laying-out pose the way Orin's body is situated on his bier.

(Here's where I go off into Speculation Land.  ;D) Perhaps whoever found her and made/commissioned the stasis net was a student of hers (even a fellow Airsid initiate?).  If it was a student/several students, they might not have wanted to handle her body too extensively, even allowing for the limitations imposed by a body too stiff to move too much.  They may also have felt that she died where she wanted to die and/or where she wanted her body to be placed in death.

As to exactly when and how she sustained the wound(s) that took her life, that's a good question.  She could have been in the middle of pleading with Llarik for the lives of the princes when [the second Queen/whoever didn't want Jodotha to succeed or, more likely, minions of the person(s) who wanted Llarik's sons dead] attacked her, or someone who knew she was coming to that end ambushed her before she got there at all. 

(Speculation Land Alert!)  Or, she could have succeeded in getting Llarik to reconsider executing his sons, and someone who didn't want the princes to live set up an attack against her on her way back and then pinned the blame on someone else (the princes themselves don't seem a very likely culprit for fall guys; it just doesn't make sense that they'd kill a powerful, well-trained Deryni Healer who'd just saved their bacon, but it sounds like that court was. . .interesting, and there might have been others on whom to blame Jodotha's death), which might have made Llarik (who seems a bit hot-tempered from what little we know of him) change his mind again, because we do know he did in fact execute his sons/the princes in the end.

And as to why Jodotha dragged herself to Orin's burial place rather than attempting to Heal herself with her dying energy, if she did make it to Llarik but failed to save the princes, perhaps she felt she'd failed in a very important task and didn't have the will to Heal herself even if she technically had the energy and ability to do so.

I would imagine if anyone had known what was in those scrolls that were buried in Orin's arms and/or that they were there at all, it would have been Jodotha, though.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by Laurna on October 22, 2017, 01:04:12 pm »
Thank you for looking it up DR. I hadn't had time to do so yet.

That is very intriguing question, DR. Perhaps someone made Jobotha her own Shiral net, but then why would they not have laid her out on her own bier next to Orin's.

If Jodotha tried to clear the two princes of wrongful charges, then it seems to me that she would have been mortally wounded by the person or the person's conspirator who wanted to see the two young men removed as heirs to the kingdom. The new young wife is therefore highly suspect. The question then remains if Jodotha ever got a chance to make a plea to the king or if she was wounded before she could let out the truth.  She, herself, was a healer, so it had to be a very fatal wound. Yet one she managed to stave off long enough to get to Orin's tomb. But why go to Orin's tomb? Was she looking for solace from Orin's spirit, like that of cambers spirit. or was she looking for the black protocol that she may have guessed, or known, was buried with Orin.

So many questions left unanswered.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by DesertRose on October 22, 2017, 12:39:29 pm »
As I recall, Jodotha was found beside Orin's bier, not in a proper burial place of her own. I got the impression from where and how she was found that she knew she was mortally wounded, and therefore used the last of her energy to make her way back to Orin so she could die by his side, and then lay there undiscovered for centuries.

I don't have my books handy and can't check, but IIRC, Evaine, Joram and Queron found both Orin's and Jodotha's bodies intact under stasis nets made of purple silk thread strung with little shiral beads.  I think his bier was higher than hers, though.

Okay, it registered on me that while I don't have my paper copies of the books handy, I do have The Harrowing of Gwynedd on my Kindle app on my phone, so I went and looked up the relevant passage.

Evie is right, in that Jodotha's body was found beside Orin's bier (and not on one of her own, like I thought for whatever odd reason), with evidence of having sustained a mortal wound (bloodstains on her robe/cloak), but both bodies were intact and under a stasis net of purple silk cord strung with shiral beads.  However, in another mystery, the passage doesn't make it particularly clear whether she was under the same net as Orin, or whether someone found her body there fairly soon after her death and made a stasis net for her but left her as she'd died.

I wouldn't think Jodotha herself would have disturbed the stasis net over Orin's body, not even in her dying moments, especially given that he predeceased her by twenty-four years.  But that begs the question, were they both under the same net (and if so, who draped it over her body?), or did someone find her body, perhaps leave her as she was at her time of death (perhaps due to rigor mortis and/or an unwillingness to handle her body overmuch), and make Jodotha her own stasis net?

Both bodies were intact enough when Evaine, Joram, and Queron found them that not only could they see the colors of their clothing and hair, but facial features were still so clear that Evaine recognizes Jodotha from the portrait of her in a locket on Orin's body.  No stasis spell (at least not that we've seen so far in canon) would last several hundred years without the shiral-and-silk net.

So much to ponder. . .

Edited to correct a formatting boo-boo.
General Information, Question, and/or Ideas / Re: Pre Camber.
« Last post by DesertRose on October 21, 2017, 11:52:18 am »
As I recall, Jodotha was found beside Orin's bier, not in a proper burial place of her own. I got the impression from where and how she was found that she knew she was mortally wounded, and therefore used the last of her energy to make her way back to Orin so she could die by his side, and then lay there undiscovered for centuries.

I don't have my books handy and can't check, but IIRC, Evaine, Joram and Queron found both Orin's and Jodotha's bodies intact under stasis nets made of purple silk thread strung with little shiral beads.  I think his bier was higher than hers, though.
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