KK Chat -- 3 April 2016

[DesertRose]

Apr 03 17:12:54 *   KK has joined
Apr 03 17:12:55 *   Demercia (Mibbit@OWIRCN-ef4d7a11.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:12:57 <DesertRose>   Hi Kk
Apr 03 17:12:58 <The_Bee>   unless someone grabbed it on purpose
Apr 03 17:12:59 <DesertRose>   Hi Demercia
Apr 03 17:13:00 <Evie>   Hi KK and Demercia
Apr 03 17:13:07 <KK>   Hello, all.
Apr 03 17:13:08 <The_Bee>   Hi KK and Demercia
Apr 03 17:13:16 <revanne>   Hi KK
Apr 03 17:13:25 <DesertRose>   It was a picnic basket complete with leather holders for eating utensils.
Apr 03 17:13:30 <revanne>   and Demercia
Apr 03 17:13:39 <Demercia>   Hi.  Just Prevented  Mibbit from calling me sprocket:-)
Apr 03 17:13:43 <DesertRose>   LOL, Demercia
Apr 03 17:14:02 <Evie>   Maybe someone helped someone else pack and loaded it into a car thinking it was theirs
Apr 03 17:14:06 <revanne>   hopefully someone will get home to be greeted with "That's not our feast basket!"
Apr 03 17:14:06 <DesertRose>   Hopefully it turns up so that I don't have to commit filicide.
Apr 03 17:14:07 <drakensis>   hi KK, Demerica
Apr 03 17:14:16 <Evie>   You don't like the name Sprocket?
Apr 03 17:14:34 <Demercia>   No
Apr 03 17:14:37 <KK>   A feast basket absconded?  No no!
Apr 03 17:14:46 <DesertRose>   Yeah.
Apr 03 17:15:06 <Evie>   Could you put her on the corner with a bucket and a sign saying "Will beg for feastgear"?  ;-)
Apr 03 17:15:09 <revanne>   How much is it worth me not calling you that outside of chat:-)?
Apr 03 17:15:22 <DesertRose>   DD went to an SCA event this weekend without me (I'm having issues with medication side effects and was just not up for camping), and she posted on FB that she got to St. Augustine before realizing she'd left the feast gear basket in the hall.
Apr 03 17:15:57 <Demercia>   More than you can afford if you do.👿
Apr 03 17:16:01 <DesertRose>   My hope is someone else grabbed it mistaking it for theirs and will return it.
Apr 03 17:16:08 <Evie>   You'd think it would have been turned in to Lost and Found during site clean-up
Apr 03 17:16:10 <Demercia>   I hope so DR
Apr 03 17:16:17 <revanne>   :-D
Apr 03 17:16:42 <DesertRose>   Well, the comment I saw on FB was in a thread about Lost and Found from this event, and the constable said they didn't have it.
Apr 03 17:16:54 <Evie>   Drat
Apr 03 17:17:26 <Evie>   Hm.  I suppose I should find a little basket for the littles' feastgear.  A Ziploc snack bag just isn't the same.
Apr 03 17:17:31 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 17:17:32 <KK>   I would think it will turn up.  SCA-folk, by and large, are honest.  Though there have been some notable thefts at events, almost certainly by outsiders who have infiltrated.
Apr 03 17:17:33 <The_Bee>   Well, I hope whoever has it returns it.
Apr 03 17:17:49 <DesertRose>   Yes, usually SCA people can be trusted.
Apr 03 17:18:00 <DesertRose>   So hopefully it's just a case of mistaken identity of feast baskets.
Apr 03 17:18:12 <The_Bee>   Is there any  ID on it?
Apr 03 17:18:15 <DesertRose>   Sadly no.
Apr 03 17:18:36 <DesertRose>   But hopefully someone will get home today and unpack their car in the next day or so and say, "Hey, this isn't mine!"
Apr 03 17:18:46 <Evie>   If you have a Kingdom FB page, someone might post a notice there saying they found it
Apr 03 17:18:50 <DesertRose>   We do.
Apr 03 17:19:14 <The_Bee>   Or you could poost a "lost" notice
Apr 03 17:19:25 <revanne>   does DD know you know she lost it?
Apr 03 17:19:28 <DesertRose>   I don't know.
Apr 03 17:19:47 <DesertRose>   I'm not sure if she's home yet (she should be), and I haven't actually brought it up with her yet.
Apr 03 17:19:48 <Evie>   "Lost--One feast gear basket, lousy with directions, last seen in keeping of daughter with memory problems."
Apr 03 17:19:54 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 17:19:56 <revanne>   LOL
Apr 03 17:21:45 <revanne>   My DD2 had her bike stolen from outside the railway station recently. Needless to say she hadn't insured it but because her contact address is still our home address our contents insurance covered it.
Apr 03 17:21:54 *   Jemler (Mibbit@OWIRCN-e1451415.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined
Apr 03 17:22:03 <DesertRose>   Hi Jemler
Apr 03 17:22:14 <The_Bee>   I know how you feel, DR.  My flute has gone missing.  I'm hoping I left it at church, but I they haven'y called me.
Apr 03 17:22:15 <Jemler>   Hi folks, sorry I,'m late.
Apr 03 17:22:20 <revanne>   Hi Jemler. Good to hear from you
Apr 03 17:22:21 <Demercia>   Hi Jemler, are you home now?
Apr 03 17:22:27 <Evie>   Hi Jemler
Apr 03 17:22:28 <KK>   Hello, Jemler!  How're you doing today?
Apr 03 17:22:29 <The_Bee>   Hi Jemler! How are you, and where?
Apr 03 17:22:48 <Jemler>   No. I'm getting pt at a place called The Laurels
Apr 03 17:23:15 <The_Bee>   Is the food still horrible?
Apr 03 17:23:59 <revanne>   I hope your flute turns up, Bee.
Apr 03 17:24:43 <The_Bee>   me too.  I first noticed it missing last Sunday.
Apr 03 17:25:31 <Jemler>   Hi kk. Really tired today. Having trouble sleeping.
Apr 03 17:26:01 <The_Bee>   aches and pains keeping you awake?
Apr 03 17:26:17 *   Evie_ (~IceChat9@OWIRCN-37c191df.al.charter.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:26:25 <KK>   Sleeping can be really hard in a semi-public place where stuff is going on 24/7.
Apr 03 17:26:26 <DesertRose>   Evie is having connection trouble
Apr 03 17:26:29 *   Evie has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
Apr 03 17:26:30 <The_Bee>   HI new Evie
Apr 03 17:26:34 <Evie_>   *headdesk
Apr 03 17:27:00 *   MadEvie has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout))
Apr 03 17:27:03 <Evie_>   Here, DR, Duncan says you can borrow these:  https://flic.kr/p/FNFk9h
Apr 03 17:27:41 *   Demercia has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Apr 03 17:28:09 <The_Bee>   Mibbit's making mischief
Apr 03 17:28:41 *   Demercia (Mibbit@842092.C19ECF.3A0E88.7D6449) has joined
Apr 03 17:28:49 <Evie_>   rehi Sprocket
Apr 03 17:28:49 <The_Bee>   rehi Demercia
Apr 03 17:28:51 <Jemler>   I don't know. I haven't realy slept in a few days. Doctor says no the sleeping pill.
Apr 03 17:29:06 <DesertRose>   Don't know what's in the pic, Evie.  Flickr won't let me see it.
Apr 03 17:29:08 <Demercia>   Rehi everyone
Apr 03 17:29:19 <KK>   Me either, Evie.
Apr 03 17:29:45 <The_Bee>   It says you have to sign in.
Apr 03 17:29:48 <Demercia>   No intention of saying what Mibbit wanted to call me this time.  It was mutual
Apr 03 17:29:55 <revanne>   It asks me for my email before it will let me see it but then says it doesn't recognise the email address
Apr 03 17:30:02 <revanne>   ROFL
Apr 03 17:30:20 <The_Bee>   Do you need to be a member?
Apr 03 17:31:02 <KK>   It's Yahoo asking.
Apr 03 17:31:17 <DesertRose>   Yeah, Yahoo owns Flickr.
Apr 03 17:31:25 <Demercia>   That doesn't sound too good Jemler
Apr 03 17:31:27 <revanne>   i signed up to flickr earlier this year but it was in the middle of a very stressful time and I can't remember what email address I used or what password.
Apr 03 17:32:05 <KK>   Same here, Revanne.  It's been a while.
Apr 03 17:32:08 <revanne>   The insomnimonster is horrid.
Apr 03 17:32:15 *   Evie (~IceChat9@OWIRCN-37c191df.al.charter.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:32:40 <The_Bee>   Hello, Evil Evie
Apr 03 17:32:42 <Demercia>   Rehi Evie
Apr 03 17:32:50 *   Evie_ has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
Apr 03 17:33:04 <revanne>   Poor Evie
Apr 03 17:33:26 <Jemler>   Kk you missed it last sunday.
Apr 03 17:33:31 <KK>   Yes, there's a reason that sleep is called bless'ed.
Apr 03 17:34:13 <KK>   I was here, wasn't I?
Apr 03 17:34:39 <The_Bee>   Is your doctor worried about how a sleeping pill will interact with your other meds?
Apr 03 17:34:41 <Jemler>   Just before you arrived, i logged in as Teymuraz.
Apr 03 17:35:14 *   CopiousExpletivesEvie (~IceChat9@OWIRCN-37c191df.al.charter.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:35:15 <revanne>   Not suggesting that you have slain any albatrosses, Jemler but just thinking of the lines from the Ancient Mariner: To Mary Queen the praise be given, she sent the gentle sleep from heaven, that slid into my soul.
Apr 03 17:35:27 <Jemler>   I don't know bee, i haven't seen him.
Apr 03 17:35:30 <DesertRose>   Poor CopiousExpletivesEvie
Apr 03 17:35:42 *   CopiousExpletivesEvie kicks my connection
Apr 03 17:35:52 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Here, DR, try this: https://flic.kr/p/FNFk9h
Apr 03 17:36:09 <DesertRose>   Okay, got it now.
Apr 03 17:36:11 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   See if I managed to correct the problem before I got booted offline that last time
Apr 03 17:36:18 *   Evie has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
Apr 03 17:36:29 <revanne>   Ooh, nice
Apr 03 17:36:59 <KK>   It's a wee feast basket!
Apr 03 17:37:29 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Yeah. I need to figure out a way to keep my little lacquered paper bowls from getting stuck together, though.
Apr 03 17:37:32 <Demercia>   Seems like we ca either have Flickr or Evie but not both:-(
Apr 03 17:37:51 <Jemler>   No. It's a leprechaun lunchbox!
Apr 03 17:37:59 <revanne>   We've got copious expletives though!
Apr 03 17:38:11 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   yes, I can't multitask today. This connection barely supports me breathing and typing at the same time
Apr 03 17:39:05 <revanne>   slips of waxed paper?
Apr 03 17:39:08 *   Jemler sends some oxygen to Evie
Apr 03 17:39:09 *   CopiousExpletivesEvie props Mini-Duncan in front of her. "Father forgive me, for I have sinned.  I have called this connection everything but a child of God...."
Apr 03 17:39:28 <The_Bee>   Looks like the leprecchauns are enjoying a liquid lunch.
Apr 03 17:39:33 <KK>   Revanne, it's good to know that they still teach poetry in the UK.  It is an ancient mariner, he stoppeth one of three....
Apr 03 17:39:37 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Waxed paper might work.
Apr 03 17:39:54 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   I love the Rime of the Ancient Mariner
Apr 03 17:40:18 <revanne>   "By thy long white beard and wondering eye, wherefore stopst thou me?
Apr 03 17:40:39 <KK>   The water, like a witch's oil, burned red and green and white....
Apr 03 17:40:58 <Demercia>   I once told a bishop that I had been wrestling with the devil (which was why I was late for a talk he was giving) and without missing a breath he replied, accurately, "photocopier?"
Apr 03 17:41:17 <KK>   LOL, Demercia!
Apr 03 17:41:20 <The_Bee>   "God save thee, ancient mariner, from the fiends that plague thee thus!  Why lookst thou so?"
Apr 03 17:41:31 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   "Dude, I stopped you because you ran that red back on Highland Ave...." Wait, that's not in the script.
Apr 03 17:41:57 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   LOL, Demercia!
Apr 03 17:42:11 <DesertRose>   LOL, Demercia
Apr 03 17:42:37 <Jemler>   According to some paperwork i read,  my doctor expects another month. It's already been a week.
Apr 03 17:42:50 <KK>   Evie, what did you use to finish the bowls?
Apr 03 17:42:54 <revanne>   That's a pain, Jemler.
Apr 03 17:42:57 <DesertRose>   CopiousExpletivesEvie, I was afk for a few, but I have to say I love the remark about calling the connection everything but a child of God.
Apr 03 17:43:03 <Demercia>   Like one who on a lonesome road, doth walk in fear and dread, and having once looked round walks on and no more turns his head, because he knows a frightful fiend doth close behind him tread
Apr 03 17:43:11 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Another month of bad food?  Should we send a CARE package?
Apr 03 17:43:30 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Mod Podge, KK
Apr 03 17:43:45 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   At least I think that's what I ended up finishing the with
Apr 03 17:43:49 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   *them with
Apr 03 17:44:20 <KK>   Hmmm, hard to think what other material might bond with it and not also stick.  I'd suggest clear nail polish...?
Apr 03 17:44:21 <revanne>   Conflated two comments in my head and thought mod podge was some sort of gruesome porridge Jemler was being fed!
Apr 03 17:44:59 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 17:44:59 <KK>   Gruesome is right.  And I love porridge.
Apr 03 17:44:59 <Jemler>   I'm also suppossed to start 4 hours of dialysis per session.
Apr 03 17:45:06 <DesertRose>   Eurgh, Jemler
Apr 03 17:45:06 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   The bowls are made of quilling paper wound over a small sphere, then finished with either Mod Podge or perhaps my acrylic lacquers.
Apr 03 17:45:29 <KK>   Jemler, how many hours had ou been doing?
Apr 03 17:45:52 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   Ouch.
Apr 03 17:46:08 <Jemler>   3/session. I'm still retaining water.
Apr 03 17:46:14 <DesertRose>   Yuk
Apr 03 17:46:18 <Demercia>   Afk for a bit
Apr 03 17:46:24 <revanne>   OK
Apr 03 17:46:32 <KK>   Yuk, indeed.
Apr 03 17:46:33 <revanne>   Not good, Jemler
Apr 03 17:47:22 <Jemler>   1 wk before discharge, i go home with a therapist. They will evaluate my house, and then i return to The
Apr 03 17:47:23 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   I might try my Crystal Pick craft glue next time, KK.  It dries completely clear and fairly fast, and other things I've used it on don't end up with a tacky surface.
Apr 03 17:47:39 <Jemler>   The Laurels
Apr 03 17:50:26 *   Jemler drops a ton of bricks
Apr 03 17:50:46 *   CopiousExpletivesEvie moves her foot
Apr 03 17:50:58 *   Jemler has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Apr 03 17:51:20 *   Demercia has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Apr 03 17:51:36 <revanne>   mibbit didn't like the ton of bricks
Apr 03 17:51:38 *   Jemler (Mibbit@OWIRCN-e1451415.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined
Apr 03 17:51:48 <revanne>   rehi
Apr 03 17:51:57 <Jemler>   What happened
Apr 03 17:52:05 <revanne>   did you drop the bricks on mibbit by accident
Apr 03 17:52:10 <drakensis>   that's what we were wondering, Jemler
Apr 03 17:52:28 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   He squished the Mibbit frog
Apr 03 17:52:33 <Jemler>   No one was responding.
Apr 03 17:52:47 <CopiousExpletivesEvie>   I moved my foot out of the way of the bricks
Apr 03 17:52:54 <The_Bee>   mibbit has declared war on this chatroom.
Apr 03 17:52:59 <DesertRose>   Rehi Jemler
Apr 03 17:53:10 <revanne>   getting very sleepy
Apr 03 17:53:13 <Jemler>   Rehi folks
Apr 03 17:53:40 <DesertRose>   BTW, we're more or less stuck with Mibbit until further notice.  Sorry.  :*
Apr 03 17:53:42 <DesertRose>   :*
Apr 03 17:53:44 <DesertRose>   
Apr 03 17:53:53 <DesertRose>   I'll get that emoticon right in a minute.
Apr 03 17:54:21 <revanne>   Oh well
Apr 03 17:54:31 <KK>   Mibbit usually behaves reasonably well.  I wonder what's got it ticked off today?
Apr 03 17:54:48 <DesertRose>   Jemler dropping bricks on it, I guess. 
Apr 03 17:54:52 <Jemler>   Teymuraz?
Apr 03 17:54:55 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 17:55:07 <revanne>   Hope not!
Apr 03 17:55:20 *   TickedEvie (Mibbit@OWIRCN-37c191df.al.charter.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:55:35 <TickedEvie>   "No such host is known," Icechat says.
Apr 03 17:55:43 *   TickedEvie kicks Icechat. 
Apr 03 17:55:45 <revanne>   Hi TickedEvie
Apr 03 17:55:48 *   Evie_ (~IceChat9@OWIRCN-37c191df.al.charter.com) has joined
Apr 03 17:55:53 <TickedEvie>   THIS is Otherworlders, you daft IRC client!
Apr 03 17:56:05 <TickedEvie>   Oh, now I'm BOTH here?  :-D
Apr 03 17:56:37 <Evie_>   Yes, now I'm miraculously reconnected to the chatroom that allegedly didn't exist before!
Apr 03 17:56:39 <DesertRose>   You're here in triplicate.
Apr 03 17:56:48 *   CopiousExpletivesEvie has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
Apr 03 17:56:51 <Evie_>   Hm.  So I am.
Apr 03 17:56:52 <revanne>   And apparently unscathed Evie is here too as an idler
Apr 03 17:56:54 <DesertRose>   Okay, down to duplicate now.
Apr 03 17:57:17 *   Evie_ is now known as EvieHeadHurt
Apr 03 17:57:40 <EvieHeadHurt>   I really am glad you're here to log the transcript.
Apr 03 17:57:53 <EvieHeadHurt>   If it were up to me, this would be the most jacked up transcript of all time!
Apr 03 17:57:54 <DesertRose>   Just please don't hex my connection.
Apr 03 17:57:54 <revanne>   oh I'll miss CopiousExpetivesEvie
Apr 03 17:58:10 <EvieHeadHurt>   She's right here, I assure you. With duct tape over her mouth.
Apr 03 17:58:17 <revanne>   The final e went on another line which looked cute
Apr 03 17:58:34 <EvieHeadHurt>   Evi
Apr 03 17:58:34 <EvieHeadHurt>   e
Apr 03 17:58:37 <EvieHeadHurt>   Like that?
Apr 03 17:58:43 <revanne>   yes
Apr 03 17:59:20 <The_Bee>   DR, why did you say we're stuck with mibbit?  Is Bynw having trouble finding a replacement?
Apr 03 17:59:43 <EvieHeadHurt>   My problems aren't related to Mibbit, Bee. It's my connection here.
Apr 03 17:59:51 <DesertRose>   Well, the replacement Bynw had looked at a while back he had totally forgotten about until he noticed mention of it in last week's transcript.
Apr 03 17:59:59 <EvieHeadHurt>   I was having connection problems to the internet earlier before I entered chat
Apr 03 18:00:23 <DesertRose>   He no longer remembers the name of the possible replacement, and neither do I.
Apr 03 18:00:31 <EvieHeadHurt>   There's an alternate link on the Forum now for people having trouble getting to the chatroom via Mibbit
Apr 03 18:00:41 <KK>   I had connection problems a few weeks ago, but it fixed itself during the intervening week.
Apr 03 18:01:05 <EvieHeadHurt>   As long as you log on the forum first, you can use the Alternate Chat link to get here.
Apr 03 18:01:09 *   demercia (Mibbit@OWIRCN-ef4d7a11.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) has joined
Apr 03 18:01:10 <DesertRose>   Which is rather a shame because as I recall, it looked promising.
Apr 03 18:01:15 <EvieHeadHurt>   rehi Demercia
Apr 03 18:01:16 <DesertRose>   Rehi demercia
Apr 03 18:01:29 <The_Bee>   wb demercia
Apr 03 18:01:33 <demercia>   Rehi
Apr 03 18:02:40 <revanne>   rehi - I was just wondering whether to send out a search party
Apr 03 18:03:00 <EvieHeadHurt>   She was wrestling demons again, but the paper jam has been sorted.  ;-)
Apr 03 18:03:07 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 18:03:20 <KK>   Evie, are you on your laptop or on your phone?
Apr 03 18:03:24 <EvieHeadHurt>   Laptop
Apr 03 18:03:31 <demercia>   Nope, in a part of the house where wifi doesn't reach
Apr 03 18:03:50 <DesertRose>   Paper jams are definitely a modern effort of Titivillius, I think.
Apr 03 18:04:39 <EvieHeadHurt>   I have to be careful with my phone use this month.  I somehow managed to use up 2/3 of my monthly data ration in one week, even though I've hardly been out of the house, which makes me wonder if the spotty wifi connection has affected my phone too.
Apr 03 18:04:43 <DesertRose>   Titivillius being the patron demon of the medieval scriptorium.
Apr 03 18:04:47 <revanne>   Titivillius?
Apr 03 18:04:54 <demercia>   In my lSt job we had to keep him at bay by keeping the photocopier paper in my airing cupboard
Apr 03 18:04:54 <revanne>   Aah
Apr 03 18:04:59 <KK>   My old printer used to have problems with paper-jams.  The new one seems better, though it prints from back to front, and I haven't taken the time to try to figure out how to change that.  Not sure it can be done, actually.
Apr 03 18:05:03 <demercia>   Last job
Apr 03 18:05:07 <EvieHeadHurt>   Since it just switches over to using data if I have no wifi connection, I wouldn't necessarily notice unless there's a bigger than normal data drain, which there has been
Apr 03 18:05:53 <DesertRose>   In his original incarnation, Titivillius was to blame for any scribal errors.  Now typos are his fault, and I think we can also ascribe paper jams to him. 
Apr 03 18:06:22 <demercia>   He also infests autocorrects
Apr 03 18:06:30 <DesertRose>   Yes.  DYAC is a shrine to him.
Apr 03 18:06:33 <EvieHeadHurt>   Definitely infests mine!
Apr 03 18:07:09 <EvieHeadHurt>   I haven't been the same since my phone started blathering on about my parents' preference for a hard mistress!  LOL
Apr 03 18:07:13 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 18:08:26 <revanne>   He definitely infests any computer I use. DH and DD2 say its because I'm too impatient but like medieval scribes I prefer to blame it on someone else.
Apr 03 18:08:31 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 18:08:35 <EvieHeadHurt>   I'm wondering if DH has managed to sell our old library shelves.  We sure could use that money if he has.
Apr 03 18:08:37 <The_Bee>   Is Titivillius the patron demon of rented fingers?
Apr 03 18:08:44 <DesertRose>   Oh, to be certain, Bee.
Apr 03 18:08:52 <demercia>   perhaps it was he who got Revanne's FB page talking Spanish
Apr 03 18:08:58 <DesertRose>   Maybe so, demercia
Apr 03 18:09:20 <revanne>   Possibly - it still is - I change the settings but it then reverts
Apr 03 18:09:29 <DesertRose>   Wow, that's weird.
Apr 03 18:09:36 <EvieHeadHurt>   https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/54/Titivillus.jpg/220px-Titivillus.jpg
Apr 03 18:09:40 <demercia>   Very odd
Apr 03 18:09:50 <EvieHeadHurt>   Weird!
Apr 03 18:10:27 <revanne>   Luckily because I have French and Latin I can make sense of it and the actual comments posted are in English but the instructions on the page in Spanish.
Apr 03 18:10:36 <DesertRose>   I had mine set to talk in Pirate for a while, but I got bored with that.  I'm not sure it's still an option on FB.
Apr 03 18:10:48 <demercia>   Perhaps it heard us talking about wanting to walk the Camino and wants to get you in practice
Apr 03 18:11:00 <EvieHeadHurt>   http://www.dkingstudio.com/gallery/titivillus.html
Apr 03 18:11:34 <revanne>   possibly - though why a demon should want to encourage going on pilgrimage I can't imagine.
Apr 03 18:11:41 <EvieHeadHurt>   Now I want to check FB to see if it has a Pirate language setting. Arrr, matey!
Apr 03 18:12:01 <DesertRose>   It used to.
Apr 03 18:12:36 <demercia>   Well he isn't having any of my single Malt
Apr 03 18:12:40 <DesertRose>   I just went and looked.  It's listed as English (Pirate).
Apr 03 18:12:57 <revanne>   LOL
Apr 03 18:13:20 <revanne>   Maybe mine will do spanish pirate
Apr 03 18:13:42 <EvieHeadHurt>   LOL
Apr 03 18:13:45 <KK>   Great illo!  Verily, an icon.
Apr 03 18:13:53 <EvieHeadHurt>   But where is English (Privateer)?
Apr 03 18:13:56 <DesertRose>   LOL
Apr 03 18:14:06 <EvieHeadHurt>   I want my Letters of Marque
Apr 03 18:14:23 <DesertRose>   ROFL
Apr 03 18:14:26 <demercia>   On a different subject, I went to see Hamlet in Stratford on Friday.  It was set in a modern Central African country.  It's amazing how well that worked, the seventeenth century English didn't jar at all.   Brilliantly acted.
Apr 03 18:14:56 <revanne>   As my maiden name was Hawkins I suspect an English privateer is lurking unseen amongst you.
Apr 03 18:15:06 <EvieHeadHurt>   Shakespearean stories tend to be pretty universal.
Apr 03 18:15:43 <revanne>   Did you get a leaflet?
Apr 03 18:16:00 <demercia>   Sorry, no but can go online.
Apr 03 18:16:29 <Jemler>   I'm really worn out. I'll see everyone next week.
Apr 03 18:16:34 <EvieHeadHurt>   goodnight, jemler
Apr 03 18:16:38 <demercia>   Given that he "borrowed" most of his plots
Apr 03 18:16:50 <The_Bee>   Bye, Jemler.  Hope you feel better ssoon.
Apr 03 18:16:52 <revanne>   Ok - hope next week goes a bit better.
Apr 03 18:16:53 <demercia>   Take care Jemler.  Glad you came
Apr 03 18:17:11 <EvieHeadHurt>   Borrowed, but generally also improved upon
Apr 03 18:17:33 <EvieHeadHurt>   At least where we're able to compare version
Apr 03 18:17:38 <KK>   Sleep well, Jemler.
Apr 03 18:17:51 <EvieHeadHurt>   Eat well too, hopefully
Apr 03 18:18:02 <EvieHeadHurt>   We can hope the fare improves, anyway
Apr 03 18:18:02 <The_Bee>   demercia, if you can't go online, how did you ge;)t here?
Apr 03 18:18:07 <Jemler>   Night all
Apr 03 18:18:16 *   Jemler has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Apr 03 18:18:27 <revanne>   Other than Richard III
Apr 03 18:19:00 <demercia>   It's late, Bee, that's my excuse
Apr 03 18:19:30 <EvieHeadHurt>   True, but probably it wouldn't have helped his career to be too pro-Ricardian under a Tudor monarch
Apr 03 18:20:03 <drakensis>   not really, no
Apr 03 18:20:06 <demercia>   Or his life span
Apr 03 18:20:18 *   Eyikl (Mibbit@OWIRCN-91e71206.cable.earthlink.net) has joined
Apr 03 18:20:24 <The_Bee>   Do people in England still argue over whether Richard III got a bad deal or not?
Apr 03 18:20:34 <The_Bee>   Hi Eyiki
Apr 03 18:20:37 <EvieHeadHurt>   Hi Eyikl
Apr 03 18:20:37 <demercia>   Do they ever
Apr 03 18:20:39 <Eyikl>   Hi everyone.
Apr 03 18:20:51 <demercia>   Hi Eyikl
Apr 03 18:20:57 <drakensis>   I quite literally had a chat about it with my dad today over lunch
Apr 03 18:21:12 <Eyikl>   What would Richard III have got a bad deal on?
Apr 03 18:21:29 <EvieHeadHurt>   Menswear. 
Apr 03 18:21:32 <demercia>   Especially those in Leicester who have just reburied him
Apr 03 18:21:41 <demercia>   Headgear especially
Apr 03 18:21:58 <The_Bee>   His supporters say he was freamed for the deaths of his nephews--"the princes in the tower."
Apr 03 18:22:01 <EvieHeadHurt>   Historical reputation, Eyikl.
Apr 03 18:22:02 <KK>   I'm sure that finding his body has reawakened all kinds of rehabilitation talk.
Apr 03 18:22:07 <drakensis>   it's kind of hard to say how well he'd have done as king over a longer term. he seems to have been a capable duke but that doesn't always translate well
Apr 03 18:22:25 <Eyikl>   Well now we now we didn't have a hunchback
Apr 03 18:22:31 <EvieHeadHurt>   Whether he was really the monster that Shakespeare / the Tudors made him out to be
Apr 03 18:23:01 <EvieHeadHurt>   His skeletal remains showed scoliosis, I thought?  Though not so severe that he couldn't ride into battle.
Apr 03 18:23:07 <DesertRose>   Hi Eyikl.  Sorry, was afk.
Apr 03 18:23:08 *   marianne (Mibbit@OWIRCN-9eebe470.range86-140.btcentralplus.com) has joined
Apr 03 18:23:14 <The_Bee>   HI marianne
Apr 03 18:23:27 <Eyikl>   Hi marianne
Apr 03 18:23:28 <EvieHeadHurt>   hi marianne
Apr 03 18:23:30 *   revanne has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
Apr 03 18:23:37 <marianne>   hi - it wouldn't let me come back in as revanne
Apr 03 18:23:47 <DesertRose>   Ah, I thought that might be you.
Apr 03 18:23:48 <EvieHeadHurt>   I wondered if that was you or if you had a clone
Apr 03 18:23:59 <marianne>   Hi Eyikl
Apr 03 18:24:03 <Eyikl>   hi
Apr 03 18:24:09 <DesertRose>   It wouldn't let you in as revanne because you were still here as revanne, at least as far as the server was concerned.
Apr 03 18:24:15 <marianne>   Yes - but she's already here.
Apr 03 18:24:30 <demercia>   But whether or not he murdured  his nephews it is extremely ironic that the Tudors so blackened his reputation given how many of their relations they bumped off
Apr 03 18:24:42 <demercia>   Indeed I am
Apr 03 18:24:58 <marianne>   Not as far as i was concerned I wasn't, but I think that's my dodgy connection rather than mibbit.
Apr 03 18:25:35 <DesertRose>   Yes, it was rather a case of "hark who's talking" with regards to the Tudors and killing off one's relations.
Apr 03 18:26:05 <EvieHeadHurt>   Your dodgy connection on one side, your dodgy twin on the other.....  *sidesteps Demercia*
Apr 03 18:26:07 <drakensis>   well they hardly started it. and to be fair, whether or not Richard killed his nephews it's almost certain he killed Henry VI
Apr 03 18:26:32 <DesertRose>   True.  That was a dangerous time to be alive and have a claim to the throne.
Apr 03 18:26:41 <DesertRose>   However slight a claim.
Apr 03 18:27:02 <drakensis>   given the tenuous nature of Henry Tudor's claim, most definitely
Apr 03 18:27:23 <Eyikl>   It's also ironic considering Richard III gave Henry VII an excuse to invade England
Apr 03 18:27:30 <DesertRose>   And honestly, in one way or another they were all related.
Apr 03 18:27:46 <marianne>   i read somewhere that prior to 1536 10 offences carried the death penalty in England. By the end of the reign of Henry VIII in 1547 it was 50.
Apr 03 18:28:16 <DesertRose>   The lot of them were descended from Edward III one way or another (right side of the blanket or not).
Apr 03 18:28:20 <The_Bee>   Richard's  claim was largely based, wasn't it, on the grounds that his brother Edward's marriage was invalid, making Edward's sons bastards.
Apr 03 18:28:25 <DesertRose>   Yes.
Apr 03 18:28:44 <DesertRose>   Because Edward IV had supposedly been engaged to someone else when he married Elizabeth Woodville (who was his queen).
Apr 03 18:28:49 <Eyikl>   Did a lot of the offenses have to do with having the wrong religion?
Apr 03 18:29:04 <demercia>   Or even secretly married I think.
Apr 03 18:29:30 <Eyikl>   or had been engaged
Apr 03 18:29:37 <drakensis>   that's correct, DesertRose
Apr 03 18:29:57 <demercia>   More to do with saying the wrong thing about the king
Apr 03 18:29:59 <The_Bee>   not free to marry Mrs. Woodville, anyway
Apr 03 18:30:02 <DesertRose>   Yes, I think the history is a little fuzzy on whether it was an engagement or a secret marriage, but either way if it existed it would have invalidated Edward's and Elizabeth's marriage.
Apr 03 18:30:38 <The_Bee>   Have you read The Daughtrer of Tome by Josephine Tey?
Apr 03 18:30:45 <DesertRose>   Which would have rendered Edward's sons by Elizabeth (and their daughter) illegitimate.
Apr 03 18:30:57 <drakensis>   and it's dubious if there was any truth to it, but it conveniently covered that very few people wanted a child-king
Apr 03 18:31:03 <demercia>   Read it years ago,
Apr 03 18:31:07 <DesertRose>   Although that didn't stop Henry VII from marrying Edward's and Elizabeth's daughter.
Apr 03 18:31:34 <Eyikl>   well he didn't believe Richard III
Apr 03 18:31:36 <drakensis>   IIRC Henry reversed pretty much all of Richard's legislation, including that one
Apr 03 18:31:39 <demercia>   Especially in the middle of a civil war
Apr 03 18:31:58 <drakensis>   he was rather relying on Yorkist support for someo of his backing
Apr 03 18:32:04 <DesertRose>   That's true.  Politically convenient for Henry VII too.
Apr 03 18:32:48 <drakensis>   well Henry was basing his claim on "god supported me in battle" since he had no legal claim at all
Apr 03 18:32:56 <DesertRose>   Yes.
Apr 03 18:33:12 <The_Bee>   by rightr of conquest
Apr 03 18:33:17 <DesertRose>   That, and there really wasn't much anyone left alive, sane, and adult with a decent claim.
Apr 03 18:33:18 <Eyikl>   until he married Elizabth of York
Apr 03 18:33:34 <drakensis>   well, he was crowned in his own right. he was very srious about that
Apr 03 18:33:52 <DesertRose>   He was a serious bloke about a lot of things. 
Apr 03 18:34:06 <drakensis>   but since his only blood relationship to the crown was a great-grandfather who'd been specifically excluded from the succession, a fair bit of fast-talking was involved
Apr 03 18:34:18 <DesertRose>   Yes.
Apr 03 18:34:32 <KK>   brb
Apr 03 18:35:33 *   EvieHeadHurt goes to turn on overhead light and hopes she's still connected when she returns in a few seconds
Apr 03 18:35:40 <marianne>   fast-talking and dodgy dealing
Apr 03 18:35:56 <Eyikl>   I read a book that said Henry VII being a miser is what made Henry VIII such a big spender.
Apr 03 18:36:41 <DesertRose>   Quite possible, but Henry VIII should have learnt a little restraint (in a lot of things not just money) from Dear Old Dad.
Apr 03 18:37:23 <demercia>   There was some fun correspondence in the paper about how Richard shouldn't be buried in consecrated ground on account of his dubious reputation, until someone pointed out that would mean ejecting quite a few of the occupants of Westminster Abbey!
Apr 03 18:37:33 <EvieHeadHurt>   LOL
Apr 03 18:37:34 <Eyikl>   lol
Apr 03 18:37:55 <KK>   Quite true, Demercia.
Apr 03 18:37:59 <DesertRose>   I mean, I realize Henry VIII had an older brother and Henry wasn't really expected to become king, but in such an uncertain time, you'd think they'd have watched his rearing a little more closely.
Apr 03 18:38:06 <DesertRose>   ROFL, yes, demercia
Apr 03 18:38:06 <marianne>   Most of them I should think
Apr 03 18:38:35 <Eyikl>   Actually I think Henry VIII could have learned more from his dad, he just didn't want to
Apr 03 18:38:46 <DesertRose>   That's possible too.  Just rebellion.
Apr 03 18:39:11 <demercia>   He took after his maternal grandfather I think (Edward iv)
Apr 03 18:39:15 <EvieHeadHurt>   They could just install catapults in the crypt.  "Sorry, old chum, but you've a dubious reputation, so alley oop!"  *coffin launches skywards*
Apr 03 18:39:23 <DesertRose>   ROFL
Apr 03 18:39:26 <drakensis>   quite a bit, yes
Apr 03 18:39:35 <Eyikl>   Maybe that's why he made sure his daughters were well educated.
Apr 03 18:40:03 <drakensis>   and Henry VII wanted his surviving son _safe_. whereas Henry VIII wanted to go out and be a manly man, doing manly things. which were more than a little hazardous
Apr 03 18:40:05 <DesertRose>   Yes, Edward IV and Henry VIII both had a sense of "I'm king so I get to do whatever I darn well please and if you don't like it you can lump it."
Apr 03 18:40:20 <marianne>   so we're launching corpses now not mackerel?
Apr 03 18:40:25 <The_Bee>   Well, if no King Henry VII, then eventually no Elizabeth I
Apr 03 18:40:30 <DesertRose>   True.
Apr 03 18:40:46 <EvieHeadHurt>   Well, jemler's not here, so let's not waste the mackerel
Apr 03 18:42:11 <DesertRose>   I've always thought it one of history's better karmic jokes that Henry VIII was so obsessed with getting a male heir and Elizabeth's reign turned out so well and also that later science would reveal that it was him shooting X chromosomes.
Apr 03 18:42:29 <Eyikl>   Henry VII might have been feeling a little too unsafe to endanger his reputation with the lords. 
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Apr 03 18:43:15 <Eyikl>   yeah, it was a little ironic. Not to great for his first two wives though...
Apr 03 18:43:25 <DesertRose>   Not too great for several of his wives.
Apr 03 18:43:32 <KK>   What's that, Desert Rose?
Apr 03 18:43:52 *   marianne (Mibbit@OWIRCN-031ba261.range86-190.btcentralplus.com) has joined
Apr 03 18:43:55 <KK>   He did sire sons.
Apr 03 18:44:00 <EvieHeadHurt>   rehi
Apr 03 18:44:01 <The_Bee>   rehi marianne
Apr 03 18:44:04 <KK>   They just didn't last.
Apr 03 18:44:06 <marianne>   That was mibbit
Apr 03 18:44:23 <DesertRose>   Yes, but the legitimate son he sired was sickly, and Elizabeth ruled for, what, forty-five years??
Apr 03 18:44:26 <demercia>   Or weren't his wife's!
Apr 03 18:44:34 <Eyikl>   Didn't Henry Fitzroy live a while?
Apr 03 18:44:41 <drakensis>   he died in his teens
Apr 03 18:44:45 <marianne>   There's definitely a sense of some sort of retribution there.
Apr 03 18:44:50 <demercia>   Till 18 IIRC
Apr 03 18:45:05 <marianne>   Yes Elizabeth was 1558-1603
Apr 03 18:45:34 <drakensis>   night
Apr 03 18:45:37 *   drakensis has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
Apr 03 18:45:40 <marianne>   night
Apr 03 18:45:48 <demercia>   Night.
Apr 03 18:45:51 <KK>   Whoo, quick departure.
Apr 03 18:45:53 <DesertRose>   Sorry for the double question marks there.  Typo.
Apr 03 18:46:03 <DesertRose>   Yeah, drakensis bailed so fast I didn't get to say g'night.
Apr 03 18:46:17 <demercia>   Typing now impeded by ginger mog
Apr 03 18:46:26 <DesertRose>   Hi Brandysnap.
Apr 03 18:46:31 <The_Bee>   meow!
Apr 03 18:46:34 <demercia>   Purrrrr
Apr 03 18:46:54 <Eyikl>   mew?
Apr 03 18:47:11 <EvieHeadHurt>   Here comes Gigi to check Brandysnap out, apparently
Apr 03 18:47:15 <demercia>   I think he has seen the suitcase so he is a bit clingy
Apr 03 18:47:25 <demercia>   Hi Gigi
Apr 03 18:47:50 <The_Bee>   ssssssssssuitcase?  youu going somewhere?
Apr 03 18:47:50 <KK>   Elizabeth was quite a queen.  Interesting recent speculation about her genetic makeup.  One version has it that she died as a child and a boy child of about the same age was substituted and brought up as a girl.  I doubt it was true, but many of the known facts do fit the theory.h
Apr 03 18:48:01 <EvieHeadHurt>   Her curiosity apparently satisfied, she has left now
Apr 03 18:48:04 *   Kelric (~IceChat78@32F4F9.AFCB16.CAC8DB.A93869) has joined
Apr 03 18:48:10 <The_Bee>   hi kelric
Apr 03 18:48:30 <Eyikl>   Hi kelric
Apr 03 18:48:43 <DesertRose>   Hi Kelric
Apr 03 18:48:54 <demercia>   Yes.  Off to  Devon for a few days at a retreat centre
Apr 03 18:49:06 <DesertRose>   Yeah, I'm not sure I buy the boy-in-girl's-clothing theory.
Apr 03 18:49:07 <Eyikl>   Why would that have happened, KK?
Apr 03 18:49:11 <demercia>   To sleep mostly
Apr 03 18:49:43 <KK>   And you can't take the kitty with you?  Don't they know that a purring cat on the lap is conducive to meditation?
Apr 03 18:50:06 <DesertRose>   I have heard that Elizabeth may have had androgen insensitivity syndrome (where someone has XY chromosomes but due to biochemical screwups develops with female genitalia).
Apr 03 18:50:12 <The_Bee>   I can see them trying to pass off a boy as Henry's son, but....
Apr 03 18:50:44 <KK>   I think it would have been almost impossible to pull off for so many years, with the lack of privacy at court.
Apr 03 18:51:04 <DesertRose>   Yes, KK, that's why I don't buy that boy-in-girl's-clothing theory.
Apr 03 18:51:16 <demercia>   I probably could but kitty gets spoiled rotten in my absence so he's happier here than on a long car journey.  But he still does the "how dare you abandon me" act very well
Apr 03 18:51:22 <DesertRose>   Elizabeth had ZERO privacy, especially once she came to the throne.
Apr 03 18:52:08 <Eyikl>   And why would they want to have passed off a boy as a princess and not a prince?
Apr 03 18:52:13 <DesertRose>   Cats are good at indignation.  Carys is particularly good at the "there's no food in my bowl" act when there is clearly food in her bowl.
Apr 03 18:52:17 <KK>   Yes, and there have also been some hermaphrodite theories.  More plausible than the substitution, but still not likely.
Apr 03 18:52:49 <KK>   As if she had to be really a man, because no woman could have done what she did....  gag
Apr 03 18:52:52 <Eyikl>   But it's not the GOOD food.
Apr 03 18:52:54 <demercia>   It always sounds to me as though people couldn't believe that she could be really female because she was so intelligent and capable
Apr 03 18:53:05 <DesertRose>   Yes, exactly.
Apr 03 18:53:31 <Eyikl>   oh... *sigh*
Apr 03 18:53:33 <The_Bee>   Melantha stayed with my neighbor when I was in post-surgical rehab last year.  When I came to get her, she hid under his bed.
Apr 03 18:53:35 <marianne>   And it seems fairly likely that Robert Dudley if not actually her lover got fairly intimate.
Apr 03 18:53:38 *   Kelric_ (~IceChat78@32F4F9.AFCB16.CAC8DB.A93869) has joined
Apr 03 18:53:46 <KK>   Eyiki, she was already born a girl, and would have been 10ish when the substitution was made.
Apr 03 18:53:51 <The_Bee>   wb kelric
Apr 03 18:54:12 *   Kelric has quit (Ping timeout: 121 seconds)
Apr 03 18:54:21 <Kelric_>   stupid internet...
Apr 03 18:54:33 <DesertRose>   Yes, I think Dudley (not to mention her numerous ladies in waiting) would have noticed if she were a man in women's clothing.
Apr 03 18:55:00 <The_Bee>   not if she was an XY with female genitalia
Apr 03 18:55:05 <demercia>   The witching hour is approaching this side of the Pond, so will say goodnight.
Apr 03 18:55:10 <DesertRose>   G'night, demercia
Apr 03 18:55:15 <Eyikl>   goodnight
Apr 03 18:55:30 <The_Bee>   good nights, demercia.  Hope your retreat is beneficial
Apr 03 18:55:32 <KK>   Good night, Demercia.  Have a good retreat.
Apr 03 18:55:36 <EvieHeadHurt>   Goodnight
Apr 03 18:55:45 <demercia>   Thanks
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Apr 03 18:56:16 <DesertRose>   I'm not even sure I buy the androgen insensitivity syndrome theory because there are several reports of laundresses reporting to various potential suitors that she was at various points still capable of becoming pregnant.
Apr 03 18:57:00 <Eyikl>   Well, if she wasn't would they have said so and possibly annoyed the suitors?
Apr 03 18:58:48 <DesertRose>   There is that, and one of her better-known faults was a fairly spectacular temper, so a mere laundress wouldn't want to cross the Queen.
Apr 03 18:58:48 <The_Bee>   What would Elizabeth have wanted them to say?
Apr 03 18:59:08 <DesertRose>   She wouldn't have wanted her marriage eligibility questioned, that's for darn sure.
Apr 03 18:59:37 <KK>   No, she used that prospect as a bargaining chip for much of her earlier reign.
Apr 03 19:00:00 <DesertRose>   She doesn't appear to have ever seriously wanted to GET married, but to be eliminated as eligible for marriage would have really ticked her off.
Apr 03 19:00:25 <DesertRose>   With the possible exception of the close call with Dudley before the death of Amy.
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Apr 03 19:01:02 <Eyikl>   Who was Amy?
Apr 03 19:01:08 <DesertRose>   Robert Dudley's wife.
Apr 03 19:01:45 <DesertRose>   She died under mysterious circumstances and said mysterious circumstances caused a huge scandal and totally ruined Dudley's prospects of marrying Elizabeth.
Apr 03 19:01:53 *   marianne (Mibbit@OWIRCN-c3f8695b.range86-169.btcentralplus.com) has joined
Apr 03 19:02:09 <marianne>   rehi
Apr 03 19:02:14 <DesertRose>   Which did not make Elizabeth happy (or Dudley--to say the least) but was probably to the greater good of England
Apr 03 19:02:18 <The_Bee>   wb, marianne
Apr 03 19:02:22 <DesertRose>   Rehi marianne
Apr 03 19:02:27 <marianne>   Thanks
Apr 03 19:02:58 <EvieHeadHurt>   hihi
Apr 03 19:04:31 <DesertRose>   Amy had what was probably breast cancer and Dudley had thought that he and Elizabeth would get married after Amy died, except that the way she died looked like she'd been murdered.  (It may be that she committed suicide or died accidentally, but there's no way to know anymore.)
Apr 03 19:04:46 <DesertRose>   Some team of scientists went to exhume her body and found that her remains were dust.
Apr 03 19:05:08 <The_Bee>   really?
Apr 03 19:05:11 <DesertRose>   Yup
Apr 03 19:05:42 <Eyikl>   was she cremated?
Apr 03 19:05:56 <DesertRose>   No, but certain types of breast cancer can affect the bones very seriously.
Apr 03 19:06:22 <Eyikl>   wierd
Apr 03 19:06:26 <DesertRose>   She may have had one of those types of breast cancer and her bones just weren't in very good shape when she was buried and didn't survive the intervening several hundred years.
Apr 03 19:06:55 <The_Bee>   I read she fell downstairs.
Apr 03 19:07:08 <DesertRose>   She was found dead at the bottom of a staircase, yes.
Apr 03 19:07:17 <EvieHeadHurt>   She did.  She either fell, jumped, or was pushed, and therein lies the dilemma
Apr 03 19:07:30 <DesertRose>   She may have fallen and due to the cancer screwing up her bones, didn't survive what should have been a relatively minor fall.
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Apr 03 19:07:46 <The_Bee>   very ambiguous.  fell, jumped or pushed?
Apr 03 19:08:03 <DesertRose>   Or she may have thrown herself down the stairs in despair over her incredibly ill health plus her husband obviously waiting for her to die so he could marry the Queen.
Apr 03 19:08:29 <EvieHeadHurt>   Also, IIRC, her household staff had all been given the day or half-day off, so there were no witnesses to see if she fell accidentally, deliberately, or was pushed over
Apr 03 19:08:44 <DesertRose>   At the time, it was thought that Dudley had hired someone to kill her, but that would have been really stupid of him and rather out of character.
Apr 03 19:08:53 <Eyikl>   Falling down stairs sounds like a very painful way to commit suicide. If she did was want to die was she trying to frame her husband?
Apr 03 19:08:58 <DesertRose>   Yes, no one was in the house but her at the time of her death.
Apr 03 19:09:31 <DesertRose>   She might have been trying to cause the ensuing scandal by committing suicide that way, yes.
Apr 03 19:09:59 <EvieHeadHurt>   "I can't keep him but you can't have him either!"
Apr 03 19:10:06 <The_Bee>   Who gave the servants the day off? If it was Amy herself that would support the suicide theory.
Apr 03 19:10:29 <Eyikl>   Or maybe they reguarly got a half-day off
Apr 03 19:10:50 <EvieHeadHurt>   Or someone could have used that half-day off to take advantage of her being alone
Apr 03 19:10:53 <DesertRose>   I've read a theory that William Cecil had her killed, even though that would have been wildly out of character for Cecil.  But the theory is that Cecil might have bent his scruples to the breaking point that one time to keep Elizabeth from marrying Dudley, which would have put Dudley on the throne (which would probably have been disastrous for England).
Apr 03 19:12:15 <Eyikl>   Would Dudley have been a bad ruler?
Apr 03 19:12:17 <DesertRose>   Yes.
Apr 03 19:12:34 <DesertRose>   He was very self-centered and he was very aware that he was Elizabeth's big blind spot.
Apr 03 19:12:48 <EvieHeadHurt>   Dudley was very full of Robert Dudley, by most accounts
Apr 03 19:14:00 <EvieHeadHurt>   I tend to wonder if Elizabeth was attracted because he shared some of the more charming aspects of Dear old Dad, but at the same time I think he would have turned out to be a horrible King (can't see him settling for Consort) because he was too much like Dear old Dad.
Apr 03 19:14:11 <The_Bee>   brb
Apr 03 19:14:20 <KK>   Sorry, just got a phone call from my mom, looking for pain-killers, so I'm going to have to sign off for tonight.  Her back is bothering her.
Apr 03 19:14:30 <DesertRose>   Okay, g'night KK.
Apr 03 19:14:35 <DesertRose>   I hope your mom feels better soon!
Apr 03 19:14:40 <DesertRose>   See you next week?
Apr 03 19:14:43 <EvieHeadHurt>   Hope she's better soon
Apr 03 19:14:45 *   KK steps onto her Portal, waves goodnight, and disappears in a shower of green sparkles.
Apr 03 19:14:54 <Eyikl>   goodnight KK
Apr 03 19:15:03 <KK>   Should be here next week.
Apr 03 19:15:08 <DesertRose>   Okay, cool.  Have a good week!
Apr 03 19:15:16 *   KK has quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)