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Author Topic: Lendour  (Read 7914 times)

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Offline Historian

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Lendour
« on: April 11, 2007, 09:15:51 pm »
So how exactly does Alaric lose Lendour? As far as I can remember, the only thing left of his Morgan heritage is the design on the edge of the banner, his name, and a few manors spread about that would be Bronwyn's dower portion. I guess this will be covered in book 3?? Or am I missing something?

Offline Shiral

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2007, 01:15:48 am »
I don't think he ever has lost Lendour--It's the Earldom attatched to the Duchy of Corwyn, as Kierney is attatched to Cassan, customarily held by the ducal heir. Kelric Alain Morgan is now the titular Earl of Lendour, although the administration thereof is very much in his father's hands until Kelric is ready to take it on.

I think the lack of mention of Lendour before the Childe Morgan books can be chalked up to Katherine's not having all the details nailed down when she began the original trilogy. Titles and what went with each Duchy was further developed by Rob Reginald in the Codex Derynianus.

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Offline tenworld

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2007, 06:27:37 pm »
is it possible that Lendour is shrouded in mist so to speak.  it is the home of the secret society that kelson and Dougal found in TQfSC, and has some other Deryni mysteries.  Perhaps the DPTB are fogging the memory of Lendour so humans forget about it

Offline BishopCullen

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2007, 07:12:35 pm »
I agree with Shiral.  As it is, it was the secondary title of Alaric Morgan, so it never really came into play.
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Offline derynifanatic64

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2007, 03:02:42 pm »
Maybe the next CM book will and maybe it won't.  I would like to see Brian's duel with Hogan in its entirety.
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Offline jemler

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2008, 06:05:26 pm »
Have you noticed a connection between certain lands and the Deryni?

Kheldour was home to a Deryni stronghold.
Beldour home of the Furstan House.
Lendour, home to Deryni Earls.

Could the "dour" word be a corruption of the word "Deryni"?

Offline Shiral

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2008, 01:27:16 am »
It's a posible working hypothesis, Jemler. Although I think it's more likely that "Deryni" evolved from "Dour" than the other way around.

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Offline BalanceTheEnergies

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2009, 07:57:47 pm »
Quote
So how exactly does Alaric lose Lendour? As far as I can remember, the only thing left of his Morgan heritage is the design on the edge of the banner, his name, and a few manors spread about that would be Bronwyn's dower portion. I guess this will be covered in book 3?? Or am I missing something?

I seem to recall that Lendour was part of the de Corwyn heritage (as in his mother's brother Ahern had it before his untimely death). Therefore, it isn't part of the Morgan lands. He doesn't really lose Lendour: his son will hold the earldom until Alaric dies (with Alaric doubtless running it during Kelric's minority). It also sounds like it is a subsidiary title of a smaller, less economically powerful area (Corwyn has a great port, after all). Besides, doesn't the poor guy have enough to do, serving his king (General and King's Champion and Privy Councillor and...) not to mention saving the kingdom? So he doesn't get to Lendour all that often. Most of the action is elsewhere.

His father refers to himself as a simple knight in In The King' Service as well. King Donal promotes him to Earl of Lendour de uxorius (in right of his wife) to give him control of sufficient income and status to help him support both Alyce and the next Duke of Corwyn, as well as a reward for loyal service. Perhaps that's why you think of Lendour as part of his Morgan lands. The bordure reflects the combination of arms when Kenneth and Alyce married (like the Ramsays taking the Mearan gold and silver checks in addition to their etoilles.) The gryphon would have the more prominent position/greater precedence in the new combined arms because it's from the larger, more important area, and because Corwyn itself retained some degree of autonomy from earlier days.
Dubito ergo sum

Offline drakensis

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2014, 03:15:52 pm »
It's clarified in the Deryni Codex (2nd edition) that the Earl of Lendour is now a secondary title to the Duke of Corwyn. Morgan granted the title to Kelric Morgan at birth.


The codex also states that Deryni is derived from Douryni which in turn comes from Heldurnii - the people of Heldurnia, later Kheldour. Beldour was known as a Deryni colony within Torenth. I'd not linked Lendour to be the same but it's very likely - the Lendour highlands were home to the Servants of Saint Camber, themselves heirs to ancient Deryni traditions.

The Deryni may or may not have originated on mythical Caerisse but it seems very probable their initial strongholds were the northern parts of the 'celtic fringe' of the Eleven Kingdoms (what later became Kheldour, Eastmarch and northern Gwynedd as well as possibly old Meara) and the northern Lendour highlands would certainly have been part of this area.

I suspect the principal Deryni movement south took place in the fifth century as the Byzantyun Empire's western provinces collapsed and significant norse invasions seem to have swept south. Their heyday - the era of men like Orin - seems to have been the sixth and seventh centuries, with Deryni explicitly involved in the rise of some of the kingdoms formed over those turbulent centuries. Given Deryni powers it's hardly unlikely that they could rise to prominence under those terms.

Torenth and Mooryn seem to have been the principal beneficaries of this with Deryni ruling dynasties and to some degree I'd imagine there was some rivalry over the Southern Sea between the western political and religious hegemony of Bremagne and the two eastern kingdoms. This would have tended to pull Deryni southerly to the hubs of the civilised west and into contact with the Arabs.

The rise of Gwynedd and other strong western kingdoms (Gwynedd, Meara, Howicce and Llannedd formally emerged over a single generation over a century after the aforementioned kingdoms and this substantially reduced Bremagne influence by the end of the 7th century and to some degree stabilised the situation. The 'high' Deryni remained more concentrated in the east but there remained ancient strongholds of the race scattered across the north and west as well as a properous frontier of Deryni expanding south of Torenth (R'Kassi, Tralia and neighbours).

And then Festil Furstan convinced his elder brother to support him into taking Gwynedd (and absorbing Mooryn) and his younger brother to make a similar play for Kheldour and established a threatening and Deryni-led alliance across  much of the Eleven Kingdoms. It may not be coincidental that Bremagne's eastern provinces broke away over this era. Outside this powerhouse alliance (fractious as inter-Furstan relations could be) there must have been genuine fear that Deryni warlords would sweep across the Eleven Kingdoms - not helped by Festil conquering Southmarch and Kierney. And the 'festillic law' did considerable damage to human-deryni relations within Gwynedd.

It seems clear there was another major movement of Deryni south out of Gwynedd (as well as west into the Connait) in the 10th century following the Haldane Restoration and the Statutes of Ramos. It wouldn't be surprising if these Deryni expected they could take positions of power in their new homelands as they had had them in Gwynedd and that would have disturbed the existing nobility of the kingdoms south of the Southern Sea. We haven't seen a huge amount of what that part of the world is like but it's clear some areas have thriving Deryni communities - Nur Hallaj seems to be ruled by Deryni and Charissa's Moors from Deryni Rising are noted as being magically capable - they likely come from the Duchy of Marluk and the other islamic provinces of Torenth's south.

Offline Laurna

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Re: Lendour
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2014, 12:29:40 am »
Sorry, but when it comes to talking about Lendour, I can not resist the temptation. I guess you may have noticed that I hold it close to my heart.

First off, the mountain range of Lendour is said to be a vary harsh landscape, with rocky mountains, steep ravines and huge forests. "lush and green in parts, this was a hard country, unforgiving to man and beast." (Codex page 155) The earldom of Lendour covers the northern portion of that mountain range. Lendour would have been the favored mountain retreat for the capital city of Valoret.  King Festil I( the Conqueror) of Gwynedd granted the Earldom to his son, Festil Junior in the year 822, the same time Festil I claims the thrown of Gwynedd. Festil Junior would be 22 years old having been born on Feb, 23, 800. I can well imaging that Festil Junior makes the most out of his father's new money and powers, and builds himself a very lavish residence and strong Earldom. He will be the next king after all. I can not wait to find out more about that in the upcoming book The King's Deryni.

When Festil III inherited Lendour it became the Duchy of Lendour.  After Festil III became King of Gwynedd, he granted the Earldom of Lendour to Cynfyn ap Dauyd who was a close friend and supporter. From 856-1090 the house of Cynfyn controlled the Earldom. Therefore, Lendour was always a strong Deryni holdout, even through the Harrowing and the decades beyond. As long as the Earls supported the new Haldane Kings and laid low in their mountains, they would have escaped the escalation against Deryni in those early years. Also, with such a harsh landscape, I can see why many Deryni families would have fled to Lendour and why the Servants of Saint Camber would have found a safe hideaway. They would have been too hard to hunt down and the earls would have put a stop to any Deryni hunter's entering their mountains.

Lendour didn't become part of the Duchy Corwyn until Earl Keryell kidnapped and married Stevana de Corwyn, who was the grand daughter of the last Duke of Corwyn, Stiofan Anthony. Stevana was the legal Heiress to the Duchy of Corwyn and she was Deryni. The merging of these two known powerful Deryni houses was, I am sure, very alarming to most of those in Gwynedd's Capital city. Corwyn is allowed to stay Deryni because it needs to be a powerful seat to hold back the Hordes of Torenth. It would be very easy for Torenth to invade Gwynedd through the lower hills of Corwyn. But because Corwyn has always held a strong boarder, Torenth has resorted to attacking further north, through the mountain passes of Eastmarch and Marley.

Now, we finally get to Alaric Morgan, grandson of Keryell Earl of Lendour, and great great grandson of Steofan Anthony last Duke of Corwyn. He holds two major titles, Duke of Corwyn and Earl of Lendour. Lendour has been absorbed into Corwyn lands but it is still a separate and important holding. A part of Lendour was to be Brownyn's dowry, the estate of Donneral. This estate is only a small portion of the western Earldom of Lendour. Which is stated in Deryni Checkmate. But on his sister's death, the land reverts back to Alaric. By hereditary rights, Alaric gives the title of Earl to his first born son, Kelric.  By this time, the Law of Ramos for Deryni to be unable to hold titles before age 25 has been overturned. I hope to read about that in The King's Deryni next week, as well.

There is more to be said about Lendour, but at this point I will stop bending your ears.

 

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